Monday, 2009-03-09

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solydzajslh: almost done00:03
solydzajslh: few more minutes00:03
lhsolydzajs: groovy, thank you00:05
solydzajslh: deployed :-) release prepared on soc-google too00:16
solydzajslh: so can we turn off maintenance mode ?;-)00:16
solydzajslh: everything is ready00:16
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lhall hail solydzajs00:26
lh:)00:26
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tansellhrm, lh goes to sleep and then another lh joins the channel02:36
tansellcan you sleep IRC?02:46
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lhMerio: never had a chance to thank y ou for all your help11:02
lhso thank you11:02
Meriolh: you're welcome, I'm pleased to help :)11:03
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dandersonsolydzajs: ping?12:43
solydzajsdanderson: pong12:43
danderson-> query12:43
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tlarsensolydzajs: Is there a conference call today?13:36
tlarsensolydzajs: It's not on my calendar.13:36
tlarsensolydzajs: (maybe I wasn't invited :)13:36
solydzajstlarsen: I don't have it too13:37
tlarsendanderson: Thanks for doing the socghop push, BTW.13:37
solydzajstlarsen: I did it :P13:38
tlarsensolydzajs: Then how were all of the commits from danderson?13:38
solydzajstlarsen: only branching13:38
solydzajstlarsen: with his nice script :-)13:39
tlarsenI just see "david.jc.anderson" on nearly all of the files.13:39
solydzajsyep but then I did all the testing, tagged the release, deployment to melange-test and socghop, created archive and uploaded it to Downloads etc13:40
tlarsendanderson wrote a script?13:40
solydzajstlarsen: yep for the first part of release :-)13:41
solydzajshe will commit soon13:41
solydzajs:-)13:41
tlarsenWhat parts of the release, the /p/soc-google/ parts?13:41
tlarsen(and where will he commit it, trunk/scripts in /p/soc-google?)13:42
solydzajstlarsen: right now it goes up to "Build and Test the Release Candidate Branch"13:42
solydzajsyep trunk/scripts in /p/soc-google, for sure on soc-google13:43
danderson(excluding the building/testing, it just does the vendor branch and branch googlification)13:43
tlarsenI am interested to see what parts it takes care of.13:43
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tlarsenOnce the script is committed, he should update the wiki page in /p/soc-google/ also.13:44
solydzajstlarsen: http://code.google.com/p/soc-google/wiki/ImportingMelangeRelease13:44
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2ne5> (at code.google.com)13:44
tlarsensolydzajs: Does his script create the .tar.gz file, too?13:44
solydzajstlarsen: the script goes down to the this "Build and Test the Release Candidate Branch"13:45
dandersontlarsen: yoohoo, I'm here :-)13:45
solydzajs;-)13:45
tlarsensolydzajs: Oh, OK.13:45
tlarsensolydzajs: We could then write a separate script that tagged a "good" release and created the .tar.gz file.13:45
solydzajstlarsen: danderson is working on improving the script :-)13:45
solydzajsdanderson: right ?13:45
solydzajs:-)13:45
dandersontlarsen: as I said, currently it handles importing a new melange release, making the google-specific initial changes to the branch. It also knows how to cherry-pick a revision from Melange trunk (with updating of the version number and appropriate commenting)13:45
dandersonI only got that far before solydzajs needed a release. But this week I'm planning to extend it to cover the other stages of releasing as well.13:46
danderson(have I gone transparent or something?)13:47
tlarsendanderson: There are multiple iterations between the part you scripted (to home in on a "good" release) and the last part.13:47
tlarsendanderson: I wouldn't mind two different scripts.13:47
tlarsendanderson: No, I can see you, but I suspected that you also can read the back-posts.13:47
tlarsendanderson: Anyway, it doesn't matter to me.  "Patches welcome!"13:48
dandersontlarsen: currently my script is similar to google's release tool. It presents a menu of stuff you can do. You don't have to repeat all steps from 1 to N to perform step N+1.13:48
tlarsendanderson: Ah, nice.13:48
tlarsendanderson: Python or bash?13:48
dandersonPython.13:48
tlarsen\o/13:48
tlarsenPython FTW.13:48
dandersonbash is nice for quick hacking, but the lack of facility for detecting processes that exit in failure bothers me13:48
tlarsendanderson: BTW, I am a Python readability reviewer again.13:48
dandersonand python also wins for more complex processing.13:48
dandersontlarsen: so I saw. But I got Python readability a few weeks before you came out of retirement :-)13:49
tlarsenNeed to go for a bit.13:49
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dandersonI however lack the practice in recent times, so I'm sure there will be naughty stuff to fix in my code.13:49
dandersonI'll submit it tonight after work. Or should I send it for review before commit?13:50
solydzajscommit it and we can do review after commit on soc-google13:50
solydzajsok ?13:50
dandersonlgtm.13:51
dandersonI'll get to it tonight, after I finish destroying the production setup for my day project.13:51
solydzajsokie dokie :-)13:52
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lhi am available on skype for a con call any time14:00
solydzajsSRabbelier: ping14:02
solydzajsLennie: ping14:02
SRabbeliersolydzajs: pong14:04
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SRabbelierlh: ping14:53
lhSRabbelier: pong14:53
SRabbelierlh: please also specify what order you want the columns in, if that matters14:53
SRabbelierlh: I just checked and it should be no more than an hour to get generic csv exports :)14:54
lhSRabbelier: will do, filing that issue later14:55
SRabbelierlh: ok :)14:55
lhSRabbelier: thank you14:55
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SRabbeliersolydzajs:  when do we apply?15:06
Lenniein a week or so :)15:07
Lennieor how many days do we have :P15:07
Lennie?15:07
lhuntil this friday15:07
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Lenniethen we'll have to apply soon :)15:08
SRabbelieryup15:09
solydzajsSRabbelier: Thursday15:10
solydzajsSRabbelier: I will work on everything tomorrow15:10
solydzajsSRabbelier: for both Melange and NUI Group :-)15:11
SRabbeliersolydzajs: :)15:11
solydzajsSRabbelier: can you add taget="_blank" to the agreement link you show ? so it opens in new window ?15:12
SRabbeliersolydzajs: sure15:12
solydzajsSRabbelier: thx15:13
SRabbelierurl = '<a href="%s" target="_blank">Full Text</a>' % self.url if self.url else ""15:13
SRabbelierlike that?15:13
solydzajsyes, but test if it works before commiting15:13
SRabbeliersolydzajs: :P15:13
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* SRabbelier excepts15:14
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noHFCSI saw the name "melange" and my face lit up.  There can never be too many Dune references ;)15:17
* SRabbelier high fives noHFCS15:18
icyI thought it had something to do with coffee15:18
noHFCShttp://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/melange15:19
tpbTitle: melange - Wiktionary (at en.wiktionary.org)15:19
SRabbelierwe need a wiki page15:20
noHFCSIt also refers to a viennese coffee too15:20
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icynoHFCS: in the german speaking regions, it's mainly used for coffee15:22
icyhttp://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melange15:22
tpbTitle: Melange – Wikipedia (at de.wikipedia.org)15:22
icytpb - the pirate bay? :)15:23
SRabbeliericy: heheh, lol15:23
noHFCSicy:  i didn't know that.  I have some friends getting back from Germany soon; I'll have to ask them.  Though the idea of coffee being the "spice of life" makes sense15:30
icy:)15:31
SRabbelierholy boop15:41
SRabbelierwe actually have a wiki page!15:41
SRabbelierhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melange_(software)15:42
lhOMG15:44
LennieWTF?15:45
Lenniewe have a wikipage15:45
Lenniewho the15:45
Lennie..15:45
lhOMG15:45
lhOMG15:45
Jeff_Slol :)15:45
lhsoooo cloooooose15:45
Lenniejohndbritton :P?15:45
Lenniehe's in the gsoc channel :)15:46
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tlarsenLooks like we spiked at a little less than 5 QPS about an hour ago.16:18
SRabbeliertlarsen: yup16:19
tlarsenURLs that are using *lots* of CPU:16:19
SRabbelierthat's what I was talking about ;)16:19
tlarsen /org_app/apply/google/gsoc200916:19
tlarsen /user/pick16:19
tlarsenWhat is /user/pick ?16:19
tlarsenAll it displays for me is a dict.16:19
SRabbeliertlarsen: obviously, since those are the only ones being used16:19
SRabbeliertlarsen: it's for autocompletion :P16:19
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tlarsenNo, they are not using the most *total* CPU, the / page is.16:20
tlarsenThey are using much more CPU *per request*.16:20
tlarsenThe org app uses 3x the CPU of the / page per view.16:20
tlarsen /user/pick uses nearly 4x.16:20
SRabbeliertlarsen: that's because / is nearly static16:20
SRabbeliertlarsen: plus it's cached16:21
SRabbeliertlarsen: duh its' gonna be faster16:21
tlarsen%-wise, they are both only 4% of total usage.16:21
tlarsenWell, those are the two URLs that are getting the "optimize this page" warnings.16:21
tlarsen /user/create_profile has issues sometimes as well:16:22
tlarsen03-09 12:40PM 51.316 /user/create_profile 500 3948ms 4951ms-cpu16:22
tlarsenTimeout: datastore timeout: operation took too long.16:22
SRabbeliertlarsen: not a lot we can do about that16:23
SRabbeliertlarsen: all it doesis a  very trivial16:24
SRabbelier**very trivial query16:24
tlarsenSo, I guess App Engine is not as robust, performance-wise, as Google infrastructure (not yet, at least).16:27
tlarsenI wonder if we will get more whining and complaining this year than in 2007 or 2008.16:27
tlarsenI just get annoyed when people characterize the old web app as a "rough ride" when we had very few outages and the performance of the app was good (except for the "dump everything in the Bigtable type CSV dumps that only one or two people used).16:28
tlarsenAnd, there is no guarantee that those same reports are going to be easy to implement with App Engine's 1000 query result and 10 second max request limits.16:29
tlarsenWe'll just have to wait and see, I suppose.16:29
SRabbeliertlarsen: we already ahve a solution for that man16:31
tlarsenDo tell.16:31
SRabbelierthose outages are not caused by tryign to get >1000 entities16:31
tlarsenI was changing the subject.16:31
SRabbelierthey are apparently-random and it's probably a GAE performance bug16:31
SRabbelierbut what we do have16:31
SRabbeliertlarsen: http://code.google.com/p/soc/source/browse/trunk/app/soc/logic/models/base.py#42816:32
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2z8+> (at code.google.com)16:32
tlarsengetAll() is pretty naive.16:33
SRabbeliertlarsen: correct16:33
tlarsenMy point is that the old web app could take 5 minutes if it wanted to, to return a CSV file.16:33
SRabbeliertlarsen: we can take 30s16:33
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tlarsenWith App Engine, even white-listed, you've got 10 seconds.16:34
SRabbeliertlarsen: it's been upped to 30s quite a while ago now16:34
tlarsenOK, 30 seconds, then.16:34
SRabbeliertlarsen: exporting a csv file takes like, 3 seconds16:34
SRabbeliertlarsen: why would I need 5m16:35
LennieTodd16:35
Lennie317 was already fixed16:36
tlarsenOK, but there wasn't a reported bug for it.16:36
tlarsenLennie: So, mark it Fixed and move on.16:36
tlarsenLennie: When I see brown-paper-bag exceptions like that in the logs, I'm going to turn them into Type-Defect issues.16:37
tlarsenLennie: If you know they are fixed, mark them so, with the revision where they were fixed and move on.16:37
tlarsenLennie: Or, you can just ignore them.  Doesn't matter to me.16:38
SRabbelierwtf 20QPS!16:38
SRabbelierthrough the roof16:38
tlarsenNot on Slashdot, Digg maybe?16:39
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SRabbelierdont' see anything on digg either16:40
Lenniecant analytics tell you where it's from?16:40
SRabbelierthe load is still constant16:41
SRabbelierLennie: yes it can16:41
SRabbelierheheh, 9% of our visitors use Chrome16:42
tlarsenLennie: By the way, you need to get used to bugs being posted in the issue tracker that are occurring on socghop but are fixed in the code base and not yet released.16:43
SRabbelierreferring from code.google.com!16:43
SRabbelieralmost all referrals come from the faq16:44
SRabbelieravg time on site, 4s16:44
Lenniehurray :p16:44
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SRabbelierlawl16:48
SRabbeliermost visitors from MTV :D16:48
Lennielol16:49
Lenniemountain view?16:49
SRabbelierlh: did you plug us at Google? :D16:49
SRabbelierLennie: yes16:49
Lennielol16:49
Lenniesweet :P16:49
lhSRabbelier: what?16:49
LennieI wanna see the data as well grmbl :P16:49
SRabbelierlh: we're getting a whole bunch of views all of a sudden16:49
lhnot yet but doing it now16:49
SRabbelierlh: oh, strange16:49
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lhSRabbelier: doing it now16:50
lhwill let you know when official mountain view pimpage goes out16:50
lh:)16:50
SRabbelierhehe, ok :D16:50
SRabbelierQPS going down again slowly now16:50
tlarsenSRabbelier: watching the reports from Google Analytics the day after each major event in the program is going to be entertaining.16:58
SRabbeliertlarsen: yes, agreed :)16:58
tlarsenSo, Pawel is going to submit the Melange org application, right?17:00
Lenniehow do I access those stats?17:01
tlarsenWoohoo.  12 actual org apps.17:01
tlarsenLennie: You can't.17:01
tlarsenLennie: Pawel and Sverre can, though.17:01
Lenniethought so :P17:02
tlarsenLennie: If you ask me really nicely, I'll add you.  :)17:02
LennieDear Todd, would you be so kind to grant me access to the Google Analytics page for socghop.appspot.com. Yours sincecerly, Lennard P.S. I will never doubt your knowledge about Luxembourg again ^_^17:02
Lenniethat any good?17:03
SRabbelierLennie: Luxembourg? :P17:03
Lennieyes17:04
tlarsenLennie: Heh, for that, I'll even throw in code.google.com/p/soc/17:04
Lennieyou have probably forgotten already SRabbelier ;)17:04
tlarsenLennie: Go here:  https://www.google.com/analytics/settings/home17:04
tpbTitle: Google Analytics (at www.google.com)17:04
SRabbelierLennie: hehe, :D17:04
Lenniecool thanks17:04
Lennietlarsen, only 4 android hits :P17:09
tlarsenLennie: I wonder if those are me?17:10
Lennielets see :P17:10
tlarsenLennie: I know I've visited the app from the phone more than once.17:10
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kblinhi folks17:11
kblinlooks like melange ate my applications17:11
Lennietlarsen, in the weekends?17:11
kblinat least I don't see them in the list of my applications17:11
tlarsenLennie: Probably.17:12
Lenniekblin, link id?17:12
SRabbelierkblin: just now, or your old ones?17:12
Lenniefor the proposal that is17:12
tlarsenWhat is the user agent for the Android browser?17:12
kblinworldforge and wine17:12
Lenniehmm, when did you make them?17:12
kblinmoments ago17:12
Lennietlarsen, no idea I just looked at OS :)17:12
kblinwine's just a dummy because I wanted to see if things work now17:12
LennieSafari / Android17:13
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tlarsenLennie: I wasn't the ones from this past weekend, though.17:13
Lenniek17:13
tlarsenLennie: So, someone else with an Android phone also hit the site.17:14
Lenniekblin, I dont see them anywhere17:14
Lennieand no errors either17:14
kblinhmm17:14
Lennieare you sure you entered them today?17:14
Lennielike within an hour or 2 ago17:15
kblinyes, I just finished17:15
SRabbelierkblin: perhaps you got an error on the application page that you didn't notice?17:15
Lenniethat is the only explanation that sounds reasonable, since there are no errors that occured on the application side17:15
tlarsenLennie: Heh, one visit each from other cities in Alabama, and then 14 from Huntsville.  Probably me and Joel.17:16
kblinyeah, my bad17:16
Lennie:)17:16
kblinI missed the "required" field for the application template17:16
Lenniethat happens17:17
Lennieif you get accepted that will be shown to the students17:17
SRabbelierkblin: you could make an issue17:17
SRabbelierkblin: that it should also give an error msg at the top of the page17:17
SRabbelierkblin: and I'll work on it17:17
tlarsenSRabbelier: In the "notice" area, perhaps?  (but a different color, maybe)17:17
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kblinLennie: It used to be optional17:17
SRabbeliertlarsen: no just at the top of the form17:17
SRabbeliertlarsen: where it shows the other errors (for hidden fields etc)17:17
Lennieit isn't anymore apparently, but a whitespace might do the trick :D17:18
tlarsen"This page contains one or more errors that must be fixed..."17:18
kblinSRabbelier: well, it does give an error right over the missing field17:18
kblinbut with all that ajax editor thing for the application template, it's easy to miss17:18
* kblin hugs his browser's back button17:19
SRabbeliertlarsen: something like that :)17:19
tlarsenkblin: I'd like to see it highlighted at the top of the page, the way the "notice" area currently works (in addition to the error next to the field itself).17:19
kblinyeah17:19
SRabbeliertlarsen: it needn't be highlighted17:19
SRabbeliertlarsen: at the top of the page in red should be fine17:19
tlarsenSRabbelier: That, my friend, is *your* opinion.17:19
SRabbeliertlarsen: and I'm the one implementing it, am I not? ;)17:20
tlarsenSRabbelier: Actually, I thought kblin was offering to provide a patch.17:20
kblintlarsen: sorry, not before my thesis is done..17:21
SRabbelierkblin: I don't think he did17:21
tlarsenNah.  It was just you.17:21
Lenniekblin, subject?17:21
tlarsen(SRabbelier)17:21
kblinprotein engineering on Aconitases17:21
Lennieok17:21
Lennienm ^_^17:21
kblincomputational biology :)17:21
Lenniesounds interesting, but I can't really discuss it :P17:21
Lennieyeah I guessed something like thatw17:21
Lennieour university also offers a master degree in that area17:22
SRabbelierLennie: we do?17:22
Lennieyosh17:22
SRabbelierfancy pancy17:22
Lennietogether with Leiden I think17:22
kblinit was pretty hip some years ago, good way to get funding :)17:22
SRabbelierLennie: ah, yes that'd make sense17:22
kblinlots of universities started doing this :)17:22
tlarsenLennie, SRabbelier: Leslie just pimped GSoC 2009 internally at Google.17:23
tlarsenLennie, SRabbelier: Let's see what that does to traffic.17:23
Lenniehehe17:23
tlarsenOh, bummer.17:23
SRabbeliertlarsen: yup, and on the Google blogs too17:23
Lennieto the statsmobile!17:23
tlarsenShe sent them to a Sites doc.  Oh well.17:23
SRabbeliertlarsen: ah, shame, shame17:23
SRabbeliertlarsen: http://code.google.com/p/soc/issues/detail?id=315#c417:24
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2z9P> (at code.google.com)17:24
SRabbeliertlarsen: what were you thinking of?17:24
tlarsenI *was* thinking of having the dates/times be available in the universal context, so that any template could use one or more of the dates/times.17:24
tlarsenI think I've decided against that, though.17:25
tlarsenToo bad we don't have a way to inject variables into the Documents.17:25
SRabbeliertlarsen: yes, we totally need that17:25
SRabbeliertlarsen: Lennie and i were thinking of using regular python dict subsitution17:25
Lennienot for documents though17:25
tlarsenSRabbelier: I wonder if you could run a Document through the Django template engine before displaying it.17:26
Lenniesince you need to think about what is available where17:26
SRabbelierLennie: oh, just for mails?17:26
SRabbeliertlarsen: yup, we could totally do that17:26
tlarsenSRabbelier: and have some sort of ACL on that feature, of course.17:26
SRabbeliertlarsen: we can limit which variables we expose based on ACL17:26
tlarsenSRabbelier: Yep.17:26
SRabbeliertlarsen: like, we could always provide the user with {{ site_name }} and stuff17:26
tlarsenSo, do you want me to write up a Type-Feature issue, then?  :)17:26
SRabbeliertlarsen: for document templating?17:27
tlarsenYes.17:27
SRabbeliertlarsen: sure, sounds good17:27
SRabbeliertlarsen: I'm thinking we can best run it through Django17:27
SRabbeliertlarsen: as that's most natural with the Documents already being valid HTML themselves17:27
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kblinSRabbelier: Issue 318, whenever you feel like it :)17:27
SRabbeliertlarsen: and it also makes it possible to do advanced things like {{ site.foo.bar }}17:27
SRabbelierkblin: awesome17:28
kblinthanks :)17:28
kblinaw, just whitespace doesn't work for the application template17:28
SRabbelierkblin: correct, there's an issue for that17:29
SRabbelierhttp://code.google.com/p/soc/issues/detail?id=31617:29
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2z9b> (at code.google.com)17:29
durin42SRabbelier: you need to make sure to validate on save in that case17:31
durin42SRabbelier: so you don't start 500'ing the app17:32
SRabbelierdurin42: validate what?17:32
durin42the template markup17:32
durin42that is, actually parse it into a template instance before save17:32
tlarsendurin42: Yeah, and catch all of the exceptions that are raised ("You don't have permission to use {{ foo }}", etc.") and display them as form errors.17:33
SRabbelierdurin42: ooh, like that :)17:33
SRabbelierdurin42: yes, we can totally render the document on save and except any templating errors17:34
durin42tlarsen: it'd be a bit tricky to enforce what variables people could use17:34
SRabbelierdurin42: nope, easy17:34
durin42probably have to make a custom subclass of context that raised on bogus variables17:34
SRabbelierdurin42: just don't provide them any variables you don't watn them to use17:34
durin42that works17:34
SRabbelieronly thing I'd worry about is them subclassing anything17:35
SRabbelierbut as that's only allowed in teh first line of the template17:35
SRabbelierit should be easy enough to scan for that methinks17:35
durin42or the include/exclude templatetags17:35
durin42you can just walk the nodelist and look for the "bad" node types17:35
SRabbelierdurin42: oooh, that's a good idea17:35
SRabbelierdurin42: what's include/exclude templatetags?17:36
SRabbelierdurin42: it's a feature17:36
SRabbelier?17:36
SRabbelierdurin42: or do we have to do it manually?17:36
durin42SRabbelier: http://docs.djangoproject.com/en/dev/ref/templates/builtins/#include17:36
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2z9l> (at docs.djangoproject.com)17:36
durin42SRabbelier: ignore me on exclude, I meant extends17:36
SRabbelieroooh, right17:36
SRabbelierdurin42: yes, exactly, include as well17:36
durin42also ssi17:37
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durin42and load17:37
SRabbelierssi?17:37
durin42and debug17:37
SRabbelierdurin42: how about we whitelist instead xD17:37
durin42SRabbelier: see the page I linked17:37
durin42SRabbelier: that's starting to look like a better move17:37
durin42I have some code somewhere that does evil things by walking a django template node AST17:38
durin42I can probably dig it up and at least get you the beginnings of it17:38
SRabbelierdurin42: hehe, as evil as the one that walks up the stack?17:38
durin42not that evil17:38
durin42although we did make an @recur decorator once that used that17:39
* SRabbelier snickers17:39
durin42I love finding "legit" uses for sys._getframe()17:39
tlarsendurin42: Oooh.  For shame!  Using "protected" API entry points.17:40
durin42tlarsen: Would that stop you? *really*?17:40
durin42It made me have second thoughts17:40
durin42but not very long17:40
tlarsendurin42: I prefer the ones that begin and end with double underscores, myself.  :)17:40
durin42I've started reading those as "magic" blah17:41
Lennie|Gonesince the app didnt blow up I'm off :)17:41
durin42instead of __blah__17:41
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LennieSRabbelier, I'll head to bed early so I can finish our practical assignment :P17:41
SRabbelierLennie: sounds like a good idea ;)17:42
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tlarsen18 org apps now.17:42
tlarsenOnly about 600 or 700 to go.17:42
SRabbeliertlarsen: you have a checklist then? :D17:45
SRabbelier[ ] asf17:45
SRabbelier[ ] gnome17:45
SRabbelier:P17:45
durin42SRabbelier: I think lh *does* have one like that17:46
durin42so she can go tell lazy/forgetful orgs that matter to go apply17:46
kblinI know she did that in 200717:46
durin42yeah, that's the only reason Adium applied17:46
durin42we still had the attitude of "eh, we're some hack project that barely matters" then17:47
SRabbelierdurin42: heheh, nice :P17:47
tlarsenSRabbelier: No, I'm just thinking of how many org apps we had to wade through last year.17:47
tlarsenYay!  A real programming language on Android:17:51
tlarsenhttp://www.damonkohler.com/2008/12/python-on-android.html17:51
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2crV> (at www.damonkohler.com)17:51
SRabbeliertlarsen: yessss!!17:58
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SRabbeliersolydzajs: wb!18:41
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tlarsenSRabbelier: Heh, you scared him away.18:42
SRabbelierlol18:42
SRabbeliertlarsen: I'm not that scary, honestly :P18:42
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VDVsxare you aware that this question : "Who will your mentors be?"19:18
VDVsxIsn't in melange right now.19:19
VDVsxI don't know if this is intentional or not, just a warning :)19:19
SRabbelierVDVsx: yeah, I saw it mentioned on #gsoc19:19
SRabbelierlh: ^^^^^^^19:19
lhoh well.19:20
lhi will update the faq19:20
SRabbelierlh: we can totally add a free text field real quick for that if need be?19:20
lhSRabbelier: no need. :)19:20
SRabbelierlh: ok :)19:21
SRabbelierlh: if you want it for later years, to the issue tracker! :P19:21
lhSRabbelier: right19:22
VDVsxlh, last year the mentors names and gmail address aren't asked in the web app ?19:22
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lhVDVsx: yes that is correct.19:23
lhyou can still list that information in one of the free text fields19:23
VDVsxlh, gonna check19:24
dandersonIs there a preferred license for melange-related stuff?19:25
dandersonI'm getting ready to commit the release script, just wondering what to shove in the header19:25
SRabbelierdanderson: we're using the apache license for everything19:25
SRabbelierdanderson: would that be good?19:25
dandersonlgtm, it's the default choice for Google open source code19:26
SRabbelierdanderson: hence why we're using it :P19:26
dandersonah, but it's no longer a Google project, remember?19:27
SRabbelieryup, true19:28
SRabbelierwe're not switching licenses halfway through though :P19:28
dandersonBen (sussman) was just saying today how it's awesome that melange is such a true open source project19:28
SRabbelierdanderson: I agree!19:28
dandersonthanks to tlarsen for being so anxious to getting it right, and to you folks for following in those tracks :)19:28
SRabbelier:)19:29
danderson(wow, and that sentence wasn't proper english... Guinness may be good for you, but grammar skills go straight out the window)19:30
SRabbelierlol :D19:31
MatthewWilkesWhich reminds me, SRabbelier, I don't believe I've said so yet, but thanks for all the time you spent on my patch - I've gone over the differences in the diffs, the bits I was unsure of have disappeared, but looks like the things I was confident of have survived :)19:31
MatthewWilkesdanderson: Have you ever heard of Brendan Behan?19:31
SRabbelierMatthewWilkes: awesome! that's very good to hear!19:31
SRabbelierMatthewWilkes: does that mean you feel more confident about submitting another patch later on perchance? ;)19:31
dandersonMatthewWilkes: not offhand, who is he?19:32
MatthewWilkesdanderson: He was a famous irish poet and drunk who was commissioned by guinness to write a slogan. He said yes, on the condition that they give him a crate of guinness in addition to his payment19:32
MatthewWilkesThey obliged, and he told them to come back the next morning19:32
MatthewWilkesThey arrived at his house at 9am, the door open, all the guinness drunk and the floor covered with paper19:33
MatthewWilkesBehan looks up at them from a chair and says, "I have it!"19:33
MatthewWilkes"Guinness makes you drunk!"19:33
SRabbelierLOL19:33
SRabbelierbrilliant19:33
dandersonnice. I'll drink to that. :P19:33
SRabbelierdanderson: you're a cool guy like that :P19:34
SRabbelierHA!19:34
SRabbelierI totally got http://tinyurl.com/new-issue19:34
tpbTitle: Google Accounts (at tinyurl.com)19:34
MatthewWilkesSRabbelier: Absolutely.  I told Pawel I'd like to be more involved and that stands19:34
SRabbelierMatthewWilkes: sweet!19:34
dandersonSRabbelier: nice.19:35
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SRabbelier:D19:36
MatthewWilkesSRabbelier: Can't have you guys struggling away alone when there are lots of python based orgs who could help, can we?19:37
SRabbelierMatthewWilkes: that would be nice actually :)19:38
MatthewWilkesand you lot should come to europython!  I'll buy you beers19:41
dandersonhey, when/where is europython?19:41
dandersonah, got the website19:41
MatthewWilkesBirmingham, July19:42
SRabbelierdanderson: do share19:42
dandersonbah, fail. It's right in the middle of Metalcamp.19:42
MatthewWilkesMy hometown19:42
dandersonhttp://www.europython.eu/19:42
tpbTitle: EuroPython : a Python Conference (at www.europython.eu)19:42
dandersonconferences come and go, but Metalcamp is once a year :P19:42
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SRabbelierdanderson: some nice names this year19:58
SRabbelierdanderson: Masters of Rock's liine-up this year is even better though19:59
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tlarsenHmmmm.  Shouldn't socghop.appspot.com displayed the maintenance mode page starting at 6:00 PM PDT?21:05
dandersontlarsen: I believe we're now live and accepting org signups. The site went to maintenance mode during the day (europe timezone), then came out of it when the announced time rolled around21:20
dandersonUnless I'm missing information about a new release happening some time soon.21:21
tlarsendanderson: That is strange.21:27
tlarsendanderson: The App Engine maintenance was scheduled to start at 6:00 PM PDT 2009/03/09.21:28
tlarsenhttp://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/converted.html?month=3&day=9&year=2009&hour=18&min=0&sec=0&p1=224&p2=021:28
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2zAH> (at www.timeanddate.com)21:28
tlarsen1:00 AM 2009/03/10 UTC21:28
tlarsen(or about 28 minutes ago)21:28
tlarsenBut, it did not.21:28
dandersonhmm. That sounds like the time we went to maintenance mode yesterday.21:29
tlarsenThat is, the socghop app did not go into "Down for Maintenance" mode as it should have.21:29
dandersonlet me check. Its possible date and time got mixed up with timezone differences.21:29
tlarsenHere is the App Engine announcement:  http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine-downtime-notify/browse_thread/thread/90c7fde1e5ccbd4b21:29
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2zAL> (at groups.google.com)21:29
tlarsentlarsen: it says 6:00 PM PST for the one on 2009/03/09, but PDT was intended (according to an internal email thread).21:30
tlarsendanderson: the warning that this was impending gave the correct UTC times.21:30
MatthewWilkeshmm, ftr, there's somebody in #gsoc saying they're getting down for maintenance messages, maybe it's your browser cache?21:30
* MatthewWilkes sees them too21:30
tlarsendanderson: Also, I believe they took the app "down for maintenance" yesterday to clear some things out of the Datastore.  That was not the same thing.21:30
tlarsenI *fixed* it.21:30
tlarsenI changed the times in Site Settings to PDT and it activated.21:31
dandersonAh.21:31
tlarsenYes, it should say Down for Maintenance *now*, but it should have 31 minutes ago and did not.21:31
dandersonThen I'm afraid it's beyond my knowledge of the code.21:31
tlarsenYeah, I can't explain it.21:31
MatthewWilkesah, right, my ParseError then :)21:31
tlarsenThe code is using datetime.datetime.utcnow(), so it should have made the correct comparisons (because all DateTime objects are stored in the Datastore as UTC).21:32
tlarsenI've opened a bug:21:34
tlarsenhttp://code.google.com/p/soc/issues/detail?id=32721:34
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2zAR> (at code.google.com)21:34
tlarsenHere is the latest thread:21:35
tlarsenhttp://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine-downtime-notify/browse_thread/thread/16d46fbc268d1ad121:35
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2zAS> (at groups.google.com)21:35
tlarsendanderson: So, the Datastore is currently read-only and memcache is disabled (so, no put() and bad performance of the app).21:35
dandersonhmm.21:37
dandersontlarsen: people in #gsoc have run into the maintenance page.21:37
dandersontlarsen: did you manually enable maintenance mode on the app just now?21:38
dandersonWhen I go to socghop.appspot.com, I get the maintenance mode blinder.21:38
dandersonMaybe it's letting you in because you're an app administrator?21:38
danderson(I'm not logged into the site right now)21:38
tlarsendanderson: Sigh.21:41
tlarsendanderson: Yes it is on *now*.21:41
tlarsenhttp://code.google.com/p/soc/issues/detail?id=32721:41
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2zAR> (at code.google.com)21:41
tlarsendanderson: It didn't come on at the correct UTC time in Site Settings.21:41
dandersondoh.21:41
tlarsendanderson: I manually changed those times to PDT.21:41
dandersonApologies, my brain runs in slow motion at 3am.21:41
tlarsendanderson: It came on, and is still on.21:41
tlarsenIt doesn't make any sense, either, since the code *appears* to be using utcnow().21:42
dandersontlarsen: could you add [email protected] as a developer on the socghop app?21:46
tlarsendanderson: Done.21:46
tlarsen(invite sent to you)21:47
dandersonThanks21:48
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