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| mithro | come on people, the PSF has 7 applications while we only have 2 :P | 00:52 |
|---|---|---|
| JLafont | I just finished my revision of my AI proposal | 00:59 |
| JLafont | submitting it now | 00:59 |
| JLafont | I wrote in some crappy pseudo code to try to explain how the program would work. | 00:59 |
| JLafont | gah, too many characters on my detailed proposal... | 01:02 |
| JLafont | Looks like I'll have to cut something off the detailed proposal. | 01:03 |
| JLafont | done | 01:08 |
| mithro | JLafont: you can link to an external document | 01:13 |
| JLafont | had to cut out the pseudo code and behavior details from the "official one" | 01:13 |
| JLafont | yeah I did | 01:13 |
| JLafont | Or at least I think I did. I put the google docs link in the external document field | 01:15 |
| mithro | JLafont: okay | 01:15 |
| JLafont | Now a break, and then I start hammering out the 3D client one | 01:16 |
| mithro | JLafont: I recommend that you add some milestones to you Timeline | 01:17 |
| mithro | with some specific details IE | 01:17 |
| mithro | AI will be able to do X | 01:17 |
| JLafont | Do you want estimated dates on the milestones? | 01:19 |
| JLafont | Or something more general like : "These are our milestones that will occur at some point during the project" | 01:22 |
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| mithro | JLafont: estimated dates are good | 01:23 |
| mithro | of course we will adjust them as we get a clearer picture of your progress | 01:23 |
| JLafont | Yeah, that makes sense. Just didn't want it to be set in stone | 01:24 |
| mithro | JLafont: this is FOSS, nothing is set in stone ;) | 01:24 |
| mithro | JLafont: I would highlight the parts in your linked document which are not in the main application? | 01:25 |
| mithro | maybe a different color? | 01:25 |
| JLafont | Sure | 01:26 |
| mithro | some things like the "this AI will be deterministic" etc would be good | 01:26 |
| JLafont | hmmm apparently I can't update the detailed description :( | 01:27 |
| mithro | JLafont: you should be able to after I leave a comment | 01:27 |
| JLafont | ok | 01:27 |
| mithro | but you only get one shot at it | 01:27 |
| mithro | (per comment) | 01:27 |
| JLafont | ok | 01:29 |
| mithro | JLafont: any luck? | 01:30 |
| JLafont | yeah, I added a comment with the milestones | 01:30 |
| JLafont | Also made a note of information not on the proposal on the external link | 01:31 |
| mithro | you google doc could use some better formatting :) | 01:32 |
| JLafont | yeah, I was just trying to keep it simple for the proposal | 01:33 |
| JLafont | Formatting now | 01:33 |
| mithro | JLafont: much easier to read now :) | 01:42 |
| JLafont | yeah | 01:42 |
| mithro | I would wrap the peusdo code in a <pre> type thing | 01:42 |
| mithro | some of your paragraph indenting is a little weird | 01:43 |
| mithro | (some paragraphs have a first line indent, some don't, some have a different size indent) | 01:43 |
| JLafont | ok indentations fixed | 01:46 |
| mithro | JLafont: still not seeing fixed with font for the code :( | 01:53 |
| JLafont | hmm | 01:53 |
| JLafont | ok | 01:53 |
| JLafont | lemme see what I can do | 01:53 |
| mithro | don't know how you do it in Google Docs - but definition lists would work much better for | 01:54 |
| mithro | Aggressive: This personality will place defense of assets at a lower priority and will place the acquisition of new assets or the destruction of enemy forces as its highest priority. This personality would attempt to use overwhelming force to crush all opponents. | 01:54 |
| mithro | that | 01:54 |
| mithro | it's a little hard to read at the moment | 01:54 |
| JLafont | ok. Removed the overwhelming force part. Added clarification that it basically meant it would assign more units to attacking. | 02:00 |
| JLafont | does the pseudo code look right now? | 02:00 |
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| mithro | JLafont: I was talking about formatting rather then the actually text | 02:11 |
| mithro | JLafont: almost there is one very very long line | 02:12 |
| mithro | /*Will take a threat with its last explored number of units, grow that number by 5% for everyturn unexplored, and determine the number of units it needs to defend succesfully. This number will be compared with the defensive power of the Planet and possible increases of those defenses of that planet from production turns.*/ | 02:12 |
| mithro | some enters might be nice :) | 02:12 |
| JLafont | haha sure | 02:13 |
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| mithro | JLafont: you have a giant gap in | 02:37 |
| mithro | Researcher: X% of RP will go into Researching until the maximum of Mark IV ships is achieved. One that is done, all the other behavioral patterns will be proportionately increased to fill in the loss of research need. | 02:37 |
| mithro | well heading home now | 02:42 |
| JLafont | thanks! | 02:45 |
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| JLP | morning all | 05:14 |
| mithro | hey JLP | 05:18 |
| mithro | more new faces | 05:18 |
| mithro | hello Sontariel and nightlyhawk | 05:18 |
| nightlyhawk | hi mithro :) | 05:19 |
| mithro | nightlyhawk: so what are you interested in again? | 05:20 |
| Sontariel | hello :) | 05:21 |
| mithro | Sontariel: so what are you interested in? | 05:22 |
| Sontariel | hmm | 05:22 |
| nightlyhawk | i like working on AI stuff, especially anything related to machine learning. but i've seen that JLafont got a good head start and is already working on a good proposal for the AI client | 05:23 |
| Sontariel | i dont decide yet :) | 05:23 |
| Sontariel | im chosing between webclient and 3d client... | 05:24 |
| mithro | nightlyhawk: AI is being a hot topic at the moment it seems | 05:30 |
| mithro | Sontariel: If you are really interested in both put in 2 applications! :) | 05:30 |
| Sontariel | mithro, i had some experience in web game dev... i worked on one browser mmorpg... | 05:33 |
| mithro | Sontariel: cool | 05:34 |
| Sontariel | its on perl + AJAX... now im very interested in ruby on rails... | 05:35 |
| mithro | I prefer python :) | 05:35 |
| Sontariel | :) | 05:36 |
| mithro | I would much prefer ruby to perl however :P | 05:36 |
| * JLP added some comments to Jabawock's proposal on wiki | 05:36 | |
| JLP | Sontariel, nightlyhawk: ahoy | 05:36 |
| Sontariel | JLP, hi %) | 05:37 |
| nightlyhawk | good morning, JLP ;) | 05:37 |
| mithro | JLP: greywhind did the mac DMG | 05:37 |
| mithro | I just going to test then upload to sf | 05:37 |
| * JLP is off to work | 05:55 | |
| mithro | JLP: have fun | 05:55 |
| mithro | JLP: uploading dmg now | 06:02 |
| mithro | ~seen xdotx | 06:17 |
| tpb | mithro: xdotx was last seen in #tp 4 days, 10 hours, 48 minutes, and 20 seconds ago: <xdotx> llnz: :) | 06:17 |
| mithro | JLP: uploaded | 06:32 |
| CIA-13 | mithro web * rb3ee239690a9 /downloads/tpclient-pywx/ (tpclient-pywx_0.3.1.dmg tpclient-pywx_0.3.1.dmg.size): Added Mac OS X binary dmg image for 0.3.1 release. | 06:38 |
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| llnz | humm... llnz-dev2 and demo1 keep crashing | 07:00 |
| mithro | :( | 07:02 |
| * llnz will have to keep an eye on it | 07:22 | |
| mithro | llnz: any ideas? | 07:28 |
| llnz | definitely something in minisec, i think | 07:28 |
| mithro | maybe triggered by the latest 0.3.1? | 07:29 |
| llnz | i wouldn't have thought so | 07:29 |
| llnz | probably something in the view or object code | 07:29 |
| mithro | llnz: did you get a chance to see my post about the persistence in tpserver-cpp? | 07:30 |
| llnz | yes, i'm working on replying to email currently | 07:30 |
| * llnz hates long days, has been awake for 18 hours so far | 07:31 | |
| mithro | :( | 07:41 |
| mithro | llnz: no hurry | 07:41 |
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| * llnz wanders off | 07:59 | |
| llnz | later all | 07:59 |
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| mithro | hello andrei | 09:42 |
| andrei | mithro, Hi | 09:43 |
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| * vi1985 *wonders why Google makes it difficult to edit the application* | 10:46 | |
| vi1985 | Hey guys, could you possibly make a small comment on my webform application so that I can update it? jezuch had done so already, but when I made a comment to acknowledge the feedback, it reverted back to not letting me edit it :-/ thanks | 11:18 |
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| mithro | vi1985: you only get one chance :/ | 11:19 |
| vi1985 | mithro: so google is simulating life now? :) | 11:19 |
| vi1985 | lol | 11:20 |
| mithro | vi1985: done | 11:21 |
| vi1985 | mithro: thank you kindly | 11:21 |
| ezod | http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/ezod_proposal | 11:29 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1j4j> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 11:29 |
| ezod | re: server configuration and single-player mode | 11:29 |
| ezod | comments are appreciated :) | 11:30 |
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| bddebian | Howdy | 12:38 |
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| * JLP gets back from work | 14:43 | |
| * JLP goes reading ezod's proposal | 14:47 | |
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| JLP | ezod: i've put some comment to your proposal | 15:19 |
| andrei | JLP, http://csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~abarbu/soc/thousand-parsec | 15:21 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1iXj> (at csclub.uwaterloo.ca) | 15:21 |
| andrei | JLP, I added to the timeline | 15:21 |
| andrei | JLP, So that it's clear what should work when | 15:21 |
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| midorikid | Hello, all! | 15:26 |
| JLP | midorikid: ahoy | 15:26 |
| JLP | andrei: i'll take a look again | 15:26 |
| ezod | JLP: thanks, taking a look now | 15:28 |
| JLP | andrei: i think it looks very good now, fine to put it into the google gsoc system | 15:29 |
| JLP | we can still polish it there if needed | 15:29 |
| JLP | midorikid: do you also plan to take part in google summer of code? | 15:31 |
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| midorikid | Yes, I do. I wanted to talk to Lee about my idea since it's in his area. I might just email the list. | 15:32 |
| JLP | midorikid: yeah, to reach llnz it is probably best to use ML | 15:33 |
| midorikid | I talked to him about unit tests for tpserver-cpp a few months ago, but he said it was in a state of flux and I should hold off on it. | 15:33 |
| midorikid | Thanks. I think I'll lurk around here anyway. :) | 15:34 |
| JLP | midorikid: yeah i remeber something, so your application will be about unit tests fo c++ server? | 15:34 |
| JLP | midorikid: feel free to, you're most welcome | 15:35 |
| ezod | JLP: re: toy code - what did you have in mind? | 15:35 |
| midorikid | Originally I was just going to do some straight up unit testing, but it looks like a protocol compliance test suite (from the ideas list) is more urgently needed. The two are pretty closely related. | 15:36 |
| JLP | ezod: for example if you have written something privately just to learn some toolkit or something like that, or maybe you have at some point done any prototype code stuff like that | 15:36 |
| JLP | midorikid: yeah protocol compliance test would be realy cool stuff to have in my opinion | 15:37 |
| ezod | JLP: cool | 15:37 |
| * JLP will now put up an announcement about the release of tpclient-pywx 0.3.1 | 15:45 | |
| JLP | bddebian: are debian/*buntu packages available? | 15:47 |
| andrei | JLP, Hurrah; thanks for all the help :) I'll put it on later tonight | 15:48 |
| andrei | JLP, Tell me if you have any other concerns about it (in terms of implementation as well) | 15:49 |
| JLP | andrei: awesome, looking forward to it | 15:49 |
| JLP | andrei: i'll read it again when it is up there after i finish writing about the new release | 15:49 |
| andrei | JLP, Thanks :) | 15:50 |
| bddebian | JLP: I have Debian packages for libtpproto and libtpclient but tpclient-pywx is not building | 15:50 |
| JLP | bddebian: aha, so i will write that they will be available soon, thanks | 15:56 |
| ezod | JLP: recommendations applied | 16:01 |
| ezod | http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/ezod_proposal | 16:01 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1j4j> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 16:01 |
| ezod | thanks | 16:01 |
| JLP | ezod: looks very good now, so you can now put it into gsoc system and we will polish it from there | 16:04 |
| ezod | great, thanks :) | 16:05 |
| ezod | for those reading/writing gsoc apps: is it necessary to duplicate the abstract in the detailed description field? | 16:14 |
| ezod | assuming it contains pertinent information to the application as a whole | 16:14 |
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| JLP | ezod: i think it is better to not dupliate it | 16:20 |
| JLP | ezod: the size of the application is limited and we can read both anyways, so no need to read the same thing twice | 16:21 |
| JLP | ezod: oh yeah, since you have the gentoo repository for tpclient-pywx, i suppose you will also update soon to version 0.3.1? | 16:22 |
| JLP | ezod: i'm asking so that i can mention it in the news | 16:22 |
| tpb | aloril has quit worldforge (purple.worldforge.org blue.worldforge.org) | 16:22 |
| ezod | JLP: yep, i'll add that | 16:23 |
| JLP | ezod: awesome, thanks | 16:24 |
| JLP | ezod: don't forget about libtpclient and libtpproto, i think they were also updated | 16:24 |
| ezod | JLP: k | 16:24 |
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| CIA-13 | jlp web * rf35c3f024560 /news/2008-03-25-2020.news: Added news about tpclient-pywx 0.3.1 | 16:36 |
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| tpb | <tpb@worldforge> New news from http://www.thousandparsec.net/tp/rss.php: wxPython Client 0.3.1 Released | 17:02 |
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| mithro | morning people | 17:37 |
| bddebian | Heya mithro | 17:43 |
| bddebian | mithro: Is setup.py for tpclient-pywx actually making the graphicdir dir ? | 17:44 |
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| JLP | mithro: ahoy | 17:50 |
| mithro | hey JLafont | 17:55 |
| mithro | bddebian: it should be | 17:55 |
| mithro | i have not had a chance to really look | 17:55 |
| mithro | bddebian: oh I see the problem | 18:02 |
| mithro | move lines 107 to 115 | 18:02 |
| mithro | to line 127 | 18:02 |
| mithro | (after try:makedirs(codepath_temp)except OSError:pass) | 18:03 |
| mithro | bblr | 18:03 |
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| midoriki` | Oiy! This connection is poor. I'll see y'all when I get home. | 18:17 |
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| mithro | JLP: thanks for handling the release | 18:48 |
| mithro | nash!? | 18:48 |
| mithro | ~seen nash_ | 18:48 |
| tpb | mithro: nash_ was last seen in #tp 6 weeks, 5 days, 21 hours, 9 minutes, and 45 seconds ago: * nash_ is back | 18:48 |
| mithro | ~seen nash | 18:48 |
| tpb | mithro: nash was last seen in #tp 3 weeks, 5 days, 18 hours, 15 minutes, and 5 seconds ago: <nash> night | 18:48 |
| JLP | mithro: no problem, just adding the news on SF.net | 18:48 |
| mithro | JLP: cool - I always forget places | 18:49 |
| mithro | JLP: we need a short announcement for freshmeat | 18:50 |
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| JLP | mithro: yeah, i have that in mind too :) | 18:52 |
| mithro | hey cherez | 18:55 |
| cherez | 'lo, Mithro. | 18:57 |
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| mithro | JLP: you can link directly to the tpclient-pywx downloads | 19:15 |
| mithro | http://www.thousandparsec.net/tp/downloads.php#tpclient-pywx | 19:15 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/JkJ> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 19:15 |
| JLP | mithro: yeah you're right, i forgot about this | 19:16 |
| mithro | JLP: any luck from the m2f guy? | 19:43 |
| JLP | mithro: didn't come around to send that yet | 19:46 |
| mithro | ahh okay | 19:47 |
| SmokingRope | i've got an updated copy of my proposal if you guys want to look it over: http://easlnx01.eas.muohio.edu/~hannasm/thousand_parsec_proposal.html | 19:55 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1ifg> (at easlnx01.eas.muohio.edu) | 19:55 |
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| JLP | SmokingRope: i'll check it out as soon as i finish puting the news on freshmeat | 19:57 |
| mithro | JLP: thanks for that | 19:58 |
| mithro | JLP: actually, do you have the forums and details to contact the m2f developer? | 19:58 |
| mithro | ezod: ping? | 19:59 |
| JLP | mithro: http://www.mail2forum.com/forums/index.php - see the red frame at the top | 19:59 |
| tpb | Title: Mail2Forum :: Index (at www.mail2forum.com) | 19:59 |
| SmokingRope | i appreciate you guys reading over the proposals | 20:00 |
| mithro | SmokingRope: no problems | 20:02 |
| mithro | I think your deliverable need a little more "functionality" behind them - IE "Client is able to login to the server" | 20:03 |
| SmokingRope | do you think more example apps and background would be good? I've got lots of source code and *some screenshots that aren't quite as relevant to the actual proposal | 20:06 |
| SmokingRope | i'm also interested in what you think of my time estimates, if anything | 20:08 |
| * JLP now looks at SmokingRope's proposal | 20:10 | |
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| mithro | SmokingRope: they could be useful | 20:13 |
| * nash_ waves | 20:13 | |
| * nash_ wonders wtf he has an underscore | 20:13 | |
| *** nash_ is now known as nash | 20:13 | |
| mithro | how goes everything? | 20:14 |
| mithro | JLP: can you invite nash to the Google doc? | 20:14 |
| nash | okay | 20:14 |
| JLP | mithro: was just about to ask for the google account :) | 20:14 |
| nash | busy bisy bisy :-) | 20:14 |
| mithro | JLP: great minds thing alike | 20:14 |
| nash | my first name last name | 20:15 |
| nash | is my gmail account | 20:16 |
| JLP | nash: invite sent | 20:18 |
| nash | cool | 20:25 |
| * nash will look later | 20:25 | |
| mithro | brb going to get coffe | 20:28 |
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| SmokingRope | has the C++ server ever been compiled on windows? | 20:48 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: http://blog.mithis.net/archives/tp/10-compiling-tpserver-cpp-under-windows | 20:51 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1cYM> (at blog.mithis.net) | 20:51 |
| JLP | there are two more blog posts after that | 20:52 |
| SmokingRope | thanks JLP | 20:53 |
| SmokingRope | on an unrelated topic, have any of you played Ascension? | 20:54 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: nope, i think i haven't even heardabout it, the closest comes Ascendancy | 20:54 |
| SmokingRope | Ascendancy, lol | 20:54 |
| SmokingRope | i haven't played it in a while, that's what i meant | 20:54 |
| SmokingRope | that was my first 4x game | 20:55 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: yeah it's an old game | 20:55 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: my first was galactic civilisations on OS/2 Warp | 20:55 |
| SmokingRope | OS/2 Warp, hehe | 20:56 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: yeah that was what was on our very first family computer :) | 20:58 |
| SmokingRope | after ascendancy i stumbled upon MOO3 | 20:59 |
| SmokingRope | my only complaint was that empire management got way too complicated after a point | 21:00 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: sadly i never played any of MOO, i guess i should some day try to run MOO2 which is supposed to be the best | 21:00 |
| SmokingRope | there is a distinct lack of publicity for 4X games | 21:02 |
| SmokingRope | i don't think i've ever noticed a new 4X game release | 21:04 |
| SmokingRope | i gues civilization could be an exception | 21:04 |
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| JLP | SmokingRope: there are some releases but they realy don't get much attention from the press or the community :( | 21:07 |
| nash | they generally aren't high profile titles aiming for vast sections of the community. | 21:07 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: oh yea some og my thoughts about your proposal (now that i finally have gotten to the end :)) | 21:07 |
| SmokingRope | it's too long isn't it! | 21:07 |
| nash | Similarly new crochet games don't make a big splash either | 21:07 |
| SmokingRope | :) | 21:07 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: ah no, i like detailed proposal, it is just that maybe it will not fit into limited space at google | 21:08 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: no worries though, you can link to the full length proposal | 21:08 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: in which case the additional things could be colored in some other color to quickly see what is the difference between the google one and the complete one | 21:09 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: other thing is that now you have phases long about one month, maybe you could also partition those into about one week long chunks and put a couple of delivarables into each week | 21:11 |
| SmokingRope | mithro said he wanted more detail there too | 21:12 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: maybe in the application submitted to google you only list delivarables points with dates and the description of phases only remains in the long verson | 21:12 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: mithro probably said he wants more points like the * the client can show universe with objects, * the client can be used to read messages ... | 21:13 |
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| SmokingRope | yea, breaking it down into smaller chunks will definitley have the individual features | 21:14 |
| SmokingRope | that stuff is usually easier to do once there is a clear design though | 21:14 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: cool, that's the way to go, easier to keep track and see how it goes, even for someone who doesn't know much about 4x for example | 21:15 |
| SmokingRope | i can definitley put in my guess now | 21:15 |
| mithro | SmokingRope: things like "The client will do x" are good | 21:15 |
| mithro | where X is things that a player might be concerned with | 21:16 |
| SmokingRope | in one of my software engineering classes we identified the dependencies of features during design, and so the set of features implemented each week was based on what was needed first | 21:16 |
| SmokingRope | i.e. can't give orders untilconnected to server and selecting things is available | 21:16 |
| mithro | SmokingRope: true, but as developers we tend to get too concerned with things like API documentation and such - I want to see things which affect an end user | 21:17 |
| mithro | nash: you see the 0.3.1 release? | 21:18 |
| mithro | JLP: do you want to add people's proposal URLs to the document? | 21:20 |
| nash | mithro: I saw it. | 21:20 |
| nash | Haven't tried | 21:21 |
| mithro | nash: should be much better under windows and Mac OS X | 21:21 |
| mithro | I spent way to much time trying to get things working better on those OSes | 21:21 |
| nash | mithro: So no reason to bother then | 21:21 |
| mithro | nash: well there are a bunch of other fixes, and it plays RFTS much better now | 21:21 |
| JLP | mithro: yeah will add them, unless someone is quicker then me | 21:22 |
| mithro | JLP: sadly, very busy at work at the moment :( | 21:22 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: also say in the application if you already have a blog/webpage where you will write about your progress | 21:28 |
| SmokingRope | hm, that's tricky | 21:28 |
| SmokingRope | it's a WIP blog | 21:28 |
| JLafont | make a Google Blog | 21:29 |
| JLafont | Thats what I'm doing at least | 21:29 |
| JLP | SmokingRope: yeah or on wordpress.com or something like that | 21:29 |
| SmokingRope | i'll look into it, a istarted my blog because i wanted source code syntax highlighting, does google have that? | 21:30 |
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| bddebian | Howdy | 21:49 |
| mithro | hey bddebian | 21:49 |
| mithro | did you get my message about a possible fix for the graphics problem? | 21:49 |
| bddebian | Yeah but haven't had a chance to try it yet :-( | 21:49 |
| mithro | bddebian: if you can confirm it works, I'll commit a patch | 21:50 |
| bddebian | OK, give me 5-10 minutes | 21:50 |
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| bddebian | mithro: Yep, seems to have worked | 21:59 |
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| ezod | patch for tpclient-pywx? may as well add this to the gentoo ebuild before i put it up | 22:03 |
| JLP | mithro: applications and links added to document | 22:10 |
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| andrei | JLP, mithro It turns out my proposal is quite a bit longer than allowed by the google form | 22:23 |
| andrei | JLP, mithro Is it ok if I just provide a link instead of the description? | 22:24 |
| andrei | It's 12.5k characters instead of 7.5k. I've always been surprised by the size limit of that form | 22:25 |
| JLP | andrei: no problem, there is a special field to provide link to a more complete document | 22:25 |
| andrei | JLP, Awesome, so I'll leave the description empty then :) | 22:26 |
| JLP | andrei: so cut some details out from google application and maybe mark the additional stuf in detailed version in some other color to quickly spot it | 22:26 |
| andrei | JLP, Ah; ok. I was just going to put the whole application on the other website | 22:27 |
| ezod | ebuilds are ready | 22:28 |
| andrei | JLP, I'll just do that; I fear cutting parts of it because it tends to be that people don't put as much importance on them | 22:28 |
| ezod | complete with new evilness in the client ebuild :D | 22:29 |
| andrei | ezod, Heh, nice. Did you ever get it into layman? | 22:29 |
| andrei | ezod, I still haven't heard back from them | 22:29 |
| ezod | andrei: haven't submitted it yet, i want to test it a little more | 22:30 |
| * ezod wonders if having a 3-line-long sed pipe in the middle of src_install() is frowned upon | 22:31 | |
| andrei | ezod, That's why layman is so great :P you don't have to worry about that sort of thing | 22:32 |
| andrei | JLP, Okies; it's submitted :) | 22:33 |
| andrei | JLP, Read it over when you get a chance and tell me what you think | 22:33 |
| andrei | Actually, anyone can read it: http://csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~abarbu/soc/thousand-parsec | 22:33 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1iXj> (at csclub.uwaterloo.ca) | 22:33 |
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| jphr | mithro: ping? | 22:45 |
| jphr | JLP: ping? | 22:46 |
| JLP | jphr: pong | 22:47 |
| jphr | JLP: can i ask you something about project roadmaps? | 22:48 |
| JLP | jphr: | 22:48 |
| JLP | sure | 22:48 |
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| jphr | JLP: would you devs rather see a GSoC student spend a week or two producing complete pseudocode for their project, or jump right in with less coding and use a more iterative approach? | 22:49 |
| JLP | jphr: hm, i think this is best to choose by yourself, what suits you best | 22:49 |
| jphr | JLP: ok, personally i am most comfortable with good pseudo-code and planning :P | 22:50 |
| mithro | jphr: pong | 22:50 |
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| mithro | jphr: I think I would the second option is best while you are still getting familiar | 22:50 |
| andrei | mithro, I updated my SoC proposal and uploaded it :) if you have time, could you take a look and tell me what you think? (and if you have any other concerns/reservations) | 22:51 |
| mithro | andrei: sure, probably won't get to it till tonight | 22:51 |
| andrei | mithro, Sure, no rush :) | 22:51 |
| jphr | mithro: oh? how bout a compromise, iteratively produce pseudo-code then implement ! hehe | 22:51 |
| mithro | andrei: don't forget to email the list so others know you have done so | 22:51 |
| andrei | mithro, Thanks | 22:51 |
| andrei | mithro, Ah, okies; I'll do so | 22:52 |
| mithro | jphr: well python is practically pseudo-code indented properly | 22:52 |
| mithro | ;) | 22:52 |
| JLafont | ^ This is true | 22:52 |
| jphr | mithro: yes yes, i had planned on using c++, i haven't actually looked at the python stuff | 22:52 |
| JLafont | I can only think of pseudocode as python code now | 22:52 |
| andrei | jphr, The risk of pseudocode is that you convince yourself something works when it doesn't | 22:53 |
| jphr | true true | 22:53 |
| andrei | jphr, That's far too easy to do (indeed, no one suspect debugging would exist up until the first bugs actually happened) | 22:53 |
| JLafont | I use pseudocode to give me a rough idea of the structure of my program | 22:53 |
| andrei | jphr, If you have time you should check out that story (I can dig up the paper); it's really interesting | 22:53 |
| jphr | andrei: sure, i'm sure my comp.sci. student assoc wouldn't mind having that too | 22:54 |
| andrei | jphr, http://portal.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=901215 | 22:55 |
| tpb | Title: The Airy Tape An Early Chapter in the History of Debugging (at portal.acm.org) | 22:55 |
| andrei | JLafont, I just draw something out and reason about how things will work and the implement it | 22:55 |
| jphr | andrei: thanks | 22:56 |
| JLafont | andrei, yeah I do that too, Both help in coding but professors generally want pseudocode | 22:56 |
| andrei | JLafont, Heh; I just hand in Haskell code instead of pseudocode usually :P Most people can't tell the difference between algorithms in haskell and pseudocode | 22:57 |
| andrei | JLafont, In plus, I like the amusement factor of writing at the bottom of my code "You can just run this using ghc" :P | 22:58 |
| JLafont | I should really look into learning haskell | 22:59 |
| andrei | jphr, There are a lot of really cool CS stories like that. I wish I'd saved all of them as I read them | 22:59 |
| jphr | andrei: hehe | 22:59 |
| jphr | andrei: I have a prof who IS just a big walking story, every time he opens his mouth its either something insightful or hilarious about working as a programmer | 23:00 |
| andrei | JLafont, You should :) It's awesome, lets you do a lot of interesting things that you can't in most languages | 23:00 |
| andrei | jphr, Heh, profs like that are nice. They don't come along very often :P | 23:01 |
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| jphr | mithro: Does TP expect GSoC students to not work during the summer? | 23:05 |
| mithro | jphr: GSoC is expected to be a "full time job" over the period | 23:05 |
| jphr | mithro: ok | 23:06 |
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| andrei | mithro, Was that meant to underscore your previous point? | 23:09 |
| andrei | mithro, (I apologize for the bad pun) | 23:10 |
| mithro | just reading logs I had a network hiccup | 23:10 |
| mithro | jphr and JLafont sorry it appears I may be getting you two confused :/ | 23:11 |
| jphr | mithro: oh? i hadn't noticed :P | 23:12 |
| JLafont | mithro, I'm confused as to how you have confused us. | 23:12 |
| mithro | jphr: well python is practically pseudo-code indented properly <- JLafont is the python interested guy? | 23:12 |
| mithro | or am I just more confused then I though | 23:13 |
| * JLafont is the one interested in Python | 23:13 | |
| jphr | mithro: oh NOW i see, Yes i am interested in c++ not python (well I am interested in python, but not for TP :P) | 23:13 |
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| _brennan | woot, i finally finished my application! | 23:30 |
| _brennan | ok, so it wasnt THAT hard | 23:30 |
| _brennan | lol | 23:30 |
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| mithro | jphr: python puesdo code is good way to test thing however | 23:36 |
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| vi1985 | By the way, anyone knows when is the estimated ETA for TP04 protocol, and will it be backward-compatible to TP03? | 23:37 |
| jphr | mithro: yes. hey, does TP have any way of showing a players actions in real time | 23:38 |
| mithro | jphr: no | 23:38 |
| jphr | mithro: say I move a ship, and instantly it moves? | 23:38 |
| jphr | mithro: does updating from the server always have to pop the gui out to the update window? | 23:39 |
| mithro | jphr: in tpclient-pywx it does | 23:39 |
| jphr | jphr: it doesn't in a different client? | 23:40 |
| mithro | jphr: in galaxie it's pretty transparent | 23:40 |
| mithro | (from what I understand) | 23:40 |
| jphr | jphr: mmkay, is it too much for a ruleset to be built with a specific client in mind? | 23:40 |
| jphr | mithro: whoops | 23:40 |
| JLafont | jphr, from how I understand it, the rulesets are defined in the server. | 23:41 |
| JLafont | jphr, and the users can use any of the clients to connect to it. | 23:42 |
| jphr | JLafont: I'm just thinking, to implement risk's turn by turn moves, it would play best if you could have VERY short rounds, of a few seconds, update, then continue. Since mithro says you cannot have actions take place instantly inside of a turn for a user | 23:42 |
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| mithro | jphr: I wouldn't be very happy with that mapping personally | 23:46 |
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| jphr | mithro: Do you prefer applications be in to google b4 the end of the application period? or do you have no preference | 23:52 |
| andrei | jphr, They have to be in before the end | 23:53 |
| jphr | mithro: Well i think I want to try my hardest to implement risk as risk should be. I will still word my application with that as the goal. But I've noted in my documentation that I am open to implementing it with some rulechanges that would make the game fit into TP more easily | 23:53 |
| jphr | mithro: rest easy knowing I won't butcher TP if you don't want me to, but I will still try to make Risk as Risk should be :P | 23:53 |
| mithro | jphr: adapting the Risk rules is half the fun | 23:54 |
| mithro | Thousand Parsec is not a board game implimentation framework | 23:54 |
| jphr | mithro: i can see it, changing in my mind! I'll see what I can do | 23:56 |
| mithro | jphr: if you have an "example game session" then it much easier to see how it would work | 23:57 |
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| mithro | (IE a thought experiment type thing) | 23:57 |
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| jphr | mithro: Well focusing on more TP-like turns would be actually a lot easier, I would probably have to spend quite a bit of time balancing it, instead of butchering the TP framework | 23:58 |
| jphr | mithro: by example game session, do you mean walking through how things get going in the game? | 23:59 |
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