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| mithro | howdy people | 00:01 |
| nash | heyo mithro | 00:42 |
| mithro | nash: saw your bug | 00:45 |
| nash | which one? | 00:45 |
| nash | You mean the invalid access on designs? | 00:46 |
| mithro | yes | 00:46 |
| nash | Don't know what your other issue is though :-/ | 00:47 |
| nash | The 1billion odd ships however | 00:47 |
| mithro | ohh | 00:47 |
| mithro | i thought you had figure that one out | 00:47 |
| nash | However I'll see once the bug is fixed - it may be related. | 00:47 |
| nash | The 1billion x (null) - the (null) is the server bug | 00:48 |
| nash | The 1 billion may also be the server bug... I'll wait and see | 00:48 |
| nash | Tell you one thing... This has been a great way to find bugs in the server... | 00:51 |
| nash | Also I'm currently adding support for resources | 00:52 |
| nash | So getting closer to A) A human client B) MTSec support | 00:53 |
| nash | mithro: BTW: How compatible is tp04 to tp04? Is it fully backwards compatible? | 00:59 |
| mithro | you mean tp03 to tp04? | 01:04 |
| nash | No, tp04... of course that wasn't a typo... You kno wwill tp04 work with tp04... ;-) | 01:04 |
| nash | I'm just curious how much (if protocol == TP03) do X I'm going to have to do | 01:08 |
| mithro | nash: hopefully not a lot | 01:18 |
| nash | Good to know | 01:18 |
| nash | Anyway - I'm about to head of to get lunch | 01:20 |
| nash | Will talk to you later | 01:20 |
| mithro | objects are the only area i see you really needed it | 01:20 |
| nash | ? | 01:20 |
| nash | For the extra data? | 01:20 |
| mithro | anyway got to run | 01:33 |
| mithro | bblr | 01:33 |
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| mithro | howdy peoples | 02:45 |
| mithro | TBBle: did you get any further with the packaging stuff? | 02:45 |
| mithro | brb | 03:17 |
| * nash waves again | 03:23 | |
| mithro | back | 03:31 |
| nash | heyo | 03:31 |
| nash | Adding command line parameters for you ;-) | 03:31 |
| mithro | yay! | 03:31 |
| mithro | my tunnel is having problems today | 03:31 |
| mithro | so I may be a bit in and out | 03:31 |
| nash | I'm packing stuff - so I'm in and out too | 03:31 |
| nash | So I won't have internet access on the weekend most likely | 03:32 |
| nash | So don't expect to see me around then | 03:33 |
| mithro | okay :/ | 03:34 |
| nash | On the bright side I may get a lot done | 03:37 |
| nash | I'll push something up on Friday if you want to play again | 03:38 |
| mithro | okay | 03:40 |
| mithro | nash: the number of bugs you have found seems to have decreased | 03:40 |
| nash | You mean my rate? | 03:40 |
| mithro | yes | 03:42 |
| mithro | s/bugs/bugs per day/ | 03:43 |
| nash | I've found all the easy ones... | 03:43 |
| nash | From now on it's subtle stuff | 03:43 |
| nash | Besides... it's not like you've fixed them all - I'm still ahead | 03:45 |
| mithro | nash: excuses excuses | 03:45 |
| nash | So,,, is tp04 ready yet? | 03:46 |
| mithro | sure! if you s/ready/not ready/ :) | 03:47 |
| nash | BTW: Why do you guys use scheme? Why not use something a) people actually know/can write and b) portable? | 03:50 |
| mithro | nash: because nothing apart from scheme fix our criteria | 03:51 |
| mithro | and b) Scheme is highly portable | 03:51 |
| mithro | s/Scheme/subset of scheme we are using/ | 03:51 |
| mithro | s/fix/fit | 03:51 |
| nash | heh... You ever heard some something like Lua? Or Small? | 03:51 |
| mithro | I can get you the thread if you want | 03:52 |
| mithro | To do this I am going to define a scheme like language which the client will interpret. This language will be close enough to scheme that any scheme interpreter should be able to be used. Scheme was choose for these reasons, | 03:53 |
| mithro | The language is extremely simple. | 03:53 |
| mithro | * It has been already be used as an embedded language. | 03:53 |
| mithro | * It has a large number of resources for learning and coding scheme. | 03:53 |
| mithro | * Interpreters exist for C, C++, Python and Java. | 03:53 |
| mithro | * There is plenty of academic documentation on implementing your own scheme interpreter and it turns out to be a pretty trivial task. | 03:53 |
| nash | okay | 03:54 |
| nash | Surely using a subset of a language defeats the purpose of d). | 03:55 |
| nash | Finding ambedded languages is pretty trivial - I've embedded a few myself. | 03:55 |
| mithro | Lua can't be used in Java or Python | 03:55 |
| nash | I'll let the maintainers of the Lua java and lua python bindings now | 03:56 |
| nash | s/now/know/ | 03:56 |
| mithro | nash: the first iteration of tpcl was originally a stack based AND/OR thing | 03:56 |
| nash | Lovely | 03:56 |
| mithro | nash: a subset is only needed because TPCL is a requirements and formatting language really | 03:56 |
| * nash admits scheme is a lot better then roll your own language X... | 03:56 | |
| mithro | nash: the only one I found for python wasn't useable - IE you couldn't "box" the Lua code | 03:58 |
| nash | What do you mean "box"? | 03:58 |
| nash | Lua is sandboxed by language design | 03:58 |
| mithro | s/box/sandbox/ | 03:58 |
| nash | Don't export loadlib and apps can't do anything without control | 03:59 |
| mithro | nash: Luantic Python automatically exports the complete python library to Lua programs | 03:59 |
| nash | Wow - that is derranged. | 03:59 |
| * nash hadn't looked closely at it... | 04:00 | |
| mithro | nash: it's designed to be a 2way bridge | 04:00 |
| mithro | rather then a way to safely embbed Lua in Python | 04:00 |
| nash | I thought you could generate python bindings for things from C headers automatically anyway? | 04:01 |
| mithro | nash: ctypes wasn't a standard python function when tpcl was being designed | 04:01 |
| nash | okay | 04:02 |
| mithro | May 2005 is when tpcl was first suggested to use scheme | 04:02 |
| mithro | nash: another option was javascript | 04:02 |
| mithro | i do admit that Scheme is a bitch to develop in :) | 04:03 |
| nash | mithro: I've had javascript suggested as a scripting language before.. and when I revieweed it - never | 04:03 |
| nash | Never embed javascript. Asideom from a horrible language, the libs are huge, and the perfoemance bites | 04:04 |
| nash | And the bindings are toerribly non-portable | 04:04 |
| mithro | scheme is actually quite a nice language for what we want to express | 04:04 |
| nash | mithro: the scheme being a bitch would sort of rule it out to me | 04:04 |
| * nash will continue to champion lua ;-) | 04:04 | |
| mithro | nash: writing your own language would be more of a bitch :) | 04:04 |
| nash | Or maybe embed a scheme interpreter in Lua | 04:04 |
| nash | mithro: Actually compared to javascript... I'd write my own | 04:05 |
| mithro | nash: :P | 04:05 |
| mithro | nash: tpserver-cpp supports two scheme interperators - guile and mzscheme, it seems to work pretty well | 04:06 |
| nash | Hey, they aren't that hard. Any (decent) 2nd year comp student can do it | 04:06 |
| mithro | nash: that was another reason for using scheme, if you are using some horrible language which doesn't have a scheme interperator you can write your own | 04:06 |
| mithro | if I had more time I think I would write a simple "component developer IDE" which would make it much easier to new components and stuff | 04:07 |
| mithro | nash: can you think of anything else apart from Lua? | 04:08 |
| nash | Small | 04:09 |
| mithro | as in Small of Smalltalk? | 04:09 |
| nash | No | 04:09 |
| mithro | or? | 04:09 |
| mithro | URL? | 04:09 |
| nash | Off hand, I'm not sure - but it is the smallest lib I've ever seen, and it's bloody fast. Like lua it's ansi C too - which makes it as portable as you can get | 04:10 |
| nash | Ask me tomorrow, I have the URL for this and quite a few others there. | 04:10 |
| nash | Although most have some issues (For my purposes Lua and small are the champs) | 04:10 |
| nash | Things like ferite are maybes, but it's a bit obscure | 04:11 |
| nash | And neo, but I think the maintainers are dicks ;-) | 04:11 |
| * mithro is hit by a bunch of lag | 04:11 | |
| nash | Anyway - I need to go. | 04:11 |
| nash | So I'll talk to you later | 04:11 |
| mithro | okay | 04:19 |
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| nash | mithro: Haven't seen the email yet... | 06:16 |
| mithro | as I said my tunnel is having problems - for some reason emails are being a bit slow | 06:16 |
| mithro | have 7 emails in my outbox! | 06:16 |
| nash | Ahh... | 06:16 |
| nash | ouch | 06:16 |
| nash | Which email btw? | 06:16 |
| nash | And BTW: Any response from google yet? | 06:17 |
| mithro | nash: nope not yet | 06:22 |
| mithro | they are on PDT | 06:22 |
| nash | true | 06:22 |
| nash | Hmm... just tripped my race condition in the AI. D'oh. Will have to fix it sooner then I like | 06:23 |
| nash | Anyway - I'm off again... bb later | 06:24 |
| mithro | yay, for race conditions! | 06:25 |
| mithro | nash: i think that is what is causing the problem you where having with tpclient-pywx | 06:25 |
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| CIA-20 | Lee Begg <[email protected]> * tpserver-cpp/tpserver/ (playermanager.cpp playermanager.cpp): | 09:35 |
| CIA-20 | Fairness for seeing designs: | 09:35 |
| CIA-20 | Fixes 1678719, by updating the new player. I note that only the newest player suffers | 09:35 |
| CIA-20 | from this, once a newer player joins, the earlier player's visible designs gets updated. | 09:35 |
| CIA-20 | Lee Begg <[email protected]> * tpserver-cpp/tpserver/ (main.cpp settings.cpp settings.cpp): | 09:58 |
| CIA-20 | Print error message when failed to open config file: | 09:58 |
| CIA-20 | Fixes 1679547. Might change the message to something like what it suggests yet though. | 09:58 |
| TBBle | mithro: Ooops, sorry, no. Stuff came up on Sunday. | 10:19 |
| * llnz ponders | 10:34 | |
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| llnz | later all | 10:52 |
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| JLP | hello all | 12:34 |
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