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| krokodilerian | mithro: around? | 00:35 |
|---|---|---|
| mithro | krokodilerian: Kinda | 00:36 |
| krokodilerian | :) | 00:36 |
| krokodilerian | would you have time to talk now, or in 8 hours? | 00:36 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: If you have time now, lets just try and chat now? | 00:37 |
| krokodilerian | ok | 00:37 |
| krokodilerian | so, timvideos/hdmi2usb got accepted in gsoc | 00:37 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Yes! | 00:37 |
| krokodilerian | and there seem to be people willing to work on it, i have a meeting with them tomorrow | 00:38 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: It also looks like FOSDEM did too? | 00:38 |
| krokodilerian | i saw https://code.timvideos.us/summer-of-code/ | 00:38 |
| krokodilerian | hm, did it? | 00:38 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: https://summerofcode.withgoogle.com/organizations/5128547153739776/ | 00:39 |
| krokodilerian | i don't know the plans there | 00:39 |
| krokodilerian | i'll check with the guys :) | 00:39 |
| krokodilerian | my idea is to use the hdmi2usb in the second version of the fosdem boxes, but that's more work for this project than for fosdem, i think | 00:40 |
| krokodilerian | so for example, one thing that's missing is the audio input, right? | 00:41 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Well, we have limited developer resources, so if FOSDEM needs something specific then you guys will probably need to help with that development... | 00:41 |
| krokodilerian | yes, that's the reason to look for the gsoc students | 00:42 |
| krokodilerian | or you mean for them to be in the fosdem project while working on this? | 00:42 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: That is an open question I think? | 00:43 |
| krokodilerian | yes, if it's possible | 00:43 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: By "audio input" what do you mean exactly? | 00:43 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: currently the hdmi2usb has a driver/usb endpoint that behaves like a camera, with a v4l2 driver, but there's no such thing for audio, afaik | 00:44 |
| krokodilerian | so you can't capture audio with it | 00:44 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Correct | 00:44 |
| krokodilerian | so this was one example on what i can try to get people to work on (to submit a proposal, etc.) | 00:44 |
| krokodilerian | and anything else you think is relevant/useful | 00:45 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: The HDMI2USB hardware has no audio inputs/outputs unless you count the audio embedded in the HDMI streams | 00:45 |
| krokodilerian | because fosdem's requirements are pretty close to yours | 00:45 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: yes, exactly, that audio | 00:45 |
| xfxf | krokodilerian: IIRC paddatrapper is working on solving that problem, but it's still a WIP | 00:45 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: this is the usual way we get the audio, via the camera | 00:45 |
| xfxf | we just use a small USB sound card with XLR in for now | 00:46 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: How important is that too you? Do you frequently have people with audio in their presentation? | 00:46 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: hm, we plan to use this for both the camera and the presentation | 00:46 |
| krokodilerian | there's no point in using two kinds of devices | 00:46 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Do you have a block diagram (even if just a scribble on paper) of how you might deploy this? | 00:46 |
| xfxf | mithro: audio in for the camera is super useful, in most situations house sound is fed in via XLR on a prosumer cam | 00:46 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Then we can discuss which parts are good / bad ideas :-P | 00:47 |
| xfxf | krokodilerian: that said, having to use a seperate USB device is a slight inconvenience but it's worked fine for us so far | 00:47 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: gimme 5 minutes :) | 00:47 |
| krokodilerian | i have some such stuff for the current setup | 00:47 |
| krokodilerian | and i'll draw a bit | 00:47 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Okay! | 00:51 |
| krokodilerian | https://github.com/FOSDEM/video/blob/master/graph/fosdem-video-2017.pdf is the current architecture, but there's too much other detail in it | 00:52 |
| tpb | Title: video/fosdem-video-2017.pdf at master · FOSDEM/video · GitHub (at github.com) | 00:52 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: https://vasil.luodst.net/fosdem-video-now.pdf is somewhat what we have now | 00:54 |
| mithro | vasil.luodst.net’s server DNS address could not be found. | 00:54 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: https://vasil.ludost.net/fosdem-video-now.pdf is somewhat what we have now | 00:55 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: https://vasil.ludost.net/fosdem-video-future.pdf is somewhat what i want for the future | 00:55 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: https://github.com/FOSDEM/video/blob/master/graph/fosdem-video-2017.pdf is okay | 00:55 |
| tpb | Title: video/fosdem-video-2017.pdf at master · FOSDEM/video · GitHub (at github.com) | 00:55 |
| krokodilerian | (sorry, a bit sleepy) | 00:55 |
| krokodilerian | but, there are bits missing here which i need to add | 00:56 |
| krokodilerian | for example, our presenter box has a vga input, which gets split, and it then gets into the scaler, which goes in the bmd-encoder | 00:56 |
| krokodilerian | so it's possible (and has happened) that what's on the vga split output (that goes to the beamer) is not the same as what's on the scaler | 00:57 |
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| mithro | krokodilerian: Yeah, I would like to see more details of your box's insides | 00:57 |
| krokodilerian | so what i want, as a first thing is to have a programmable open device that can get the video+audio from whatever i plug in it that I can pass on without almost any CPU | 00:57 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: i definitely have that somewhere, or mark had... | 00:58 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: I'm pretty sure I've seen it somewhere.... | 00:58 |
| krokodilerian | https://lusis.eu/sites/default/files/styles/blog_medium/public/field/image/blog_post/videobox.png?itok=atsfutDq | 00:59 |
| krokodilerian | and https://lusis.eu/sites/default/files/styles/blog_full/public/field/image/blog_post/videobox.png?itok=Vb3Gf8FF | 00:59 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: The cabling diagrams in https://github.com/FOSDEM/video/blob/master/graph/ are also useful it seems | 00:59 |
| tpb | Title: video/graph at master · FOSDEM/video · GitHub (at github.com) | 00:59 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: yes, but they don't show the insides of the box | 01:00 |
| krokodilerian | one way to look at those is like a device that can : take video+audio input, display information about it, send it over the network | 01:00 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Couple of quick questions about FOSDEM | 01:00 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Is it in the same venue most years? | 01:00 |
| krokodilerian | and in the case of presenter box, can also send a copy of the input to a vga or hdmi por | 01:01 |
| krokodilerian | same venue every year, a university in Brussels | 01:01 |
| krokodilerian | 24 rooms | 01:01 |
| krokodilerian | (that have to be streamed and recorded) | 01:01 |
| krokodilerian | (oh, right, the boxes also record everything, for backup) | 01:01 |
| mithro | https://plus.google.com/photos/103261587477257884420/album/6177184071072157825/6177184079138861346 | 01:02 |
| krokodilerian | yes, exactly | 01:02 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: What is the thing in the bottom left? | 01:03 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: scaler - it has hdmi and vga inputs, and scales the output to a specific resolution and doesn't drop the output signal no matter what | 01:04 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: So the rooms you use at Brussels are VGA only? | 01:04 |
| krokodilerian | so doesn't break the stream if a laptop gets disconnected | 01:04 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: currently,most of them are vga only, some are hdmi+vga | 01:04 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Do you have the details about that scaler somewhere? | 01:04 |
| krokodilerian | but that's changing, and it's not easy to ask people to always bring vga laptops | 01:04 |
| krokodilerian | yes | 01:04 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: How comfortable would you be with asking people to bring HDMI laptops? | 01:06 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: it's LENKENG LKV391MINI, http://www.musicworld.bg/bg/m_4950000/i_52094/LENKENG_LKV391MINI.html , the only site that still has them | 01:06 |
| tpb | Title: Musicworld.bg - LENKENG LKV391MINI (at www.musicworld.bg) | 01:06 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: we won't, we need to support both hdmi and vga for the time being | 01:06 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: You only support VGA at the moment? | 01:07 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: this year we had ~10 hdmi-to-vga converters for specific cases | 01:07 |
| krokodilerian | but yes, we fully support just vga now, and it sucks | 01:07 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Would you be okay with the opposite? VGA to HDMI? | 01:07 |
| krokodilerian | maybe | 01:08 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: but i'd really prefer it we didn't need any converters | 01:08 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: and there seems to be a 2port vga module for the opsis, where one is input and one is output | 01:08 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: It's a pass thru device | 01:09 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: You have no control over the VGA output on that board | 01:09 |
| mithro | (IE You can't send the HDMI inputs out the VGA) | 01:09 |
| mithro | It does work if nothing is connected to the output though | 01:09 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: so i can input vga, but the output is not really supported atm (or ever)? | 01:10 |
| krokodilerian | if needed, we can live with a few hdmi-to-vga converters, and according to the university, they're working on replacing that everywhere | 01:11 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: We have had good success with using HDMI->VGA convertors on the output of the Opsis board | 01:11 |
| mithro | We have had mixed success with VGA->HDMI converters on the Opsis inputs | 01:12 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: How many of the existing parts do you want to reuse and what type of budget do you have? | 01:12 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: and there's no code written for the vga daughterboard, right? | 01:12 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: There is a bunch of code written for it, but nothing currently in a usable state | 01:13 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: budget-wise - i have no good idea, but we can probably buy 50-60 opsis boards | 01:13 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: at what price are you expecting to be getting the Opsis boards? | 01:13 |
| krokodilerian | 400eu? no idea, i need to run this by some people in the staff, but should be doable, as it's basically the same price as the bmd encoder | 01:14 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Okay | 01:14 |
| krokodilerian | and this is for 2019 (as i really don't think we'll have the time to do it in a year) | 01:15 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: You mentioned capture inside that box - is the BannanaPi or the BM box doing that? | 01:16 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: the bmd thing (it's connected over USB to the banana, which just takes the stream and encapsulates it in mpeg-ts in UDP) | 01:16 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: it's this thing: https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/h264prorecorder | 01:17 |
| tpb | Title: Blackmagic Design: H.264 Pro Recorder (at www.blackmagicdesign.com) | 01:17 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: how does the bmd thing save the result? | 01:17 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: there's a piece of software called bmd-streamer, which talks to it and just fetches the h.264 stream, from there we pipe it into ffmpeg and a local file | 01:18 |
| krokodilerian | the reason we use this device is that the bitrate is configurable and we don't need to do any encoding ourselves, so the banana pi suffices | 01:19 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Ahh, so capture is running on the BPi and it blackmagic board should really be called a "XXX to USB converter device" | 01:19 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: yes, exactly :) | 01:19 |
| mithro | So the Opsis board will only do MJPEG, it doesn't do H264 | 01:19 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: i know, and i think someone asked that on the ccc talk | 01:20 |
| krokodilerian | and it should be possible to get that or any other not-insanely-big codec on it | 01:20 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: It is unlikely we'll get anything like H264 any time soon either | 01:20 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Do you guys do confidence screens or similar? | 01:21 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: what's a confidence screen? | 01:21 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: A screen in front of the presenter which shows them what is currently on the screen behind them | 01:23 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: It suppose to stop them from turning around and looking at the presentation screen all the time | 01:23 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: on fosdem - no. there's something on the display of the box, but it's really small, and mostly for debugging | 01:23 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: And help when their laptop doesn't do that itself | 01:24 |
| krokodilerian | (the setup is minimalistic, as everything is multiplied 24 times) | 01:24 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: One solution CarlFK has been doing is kind of like your box, but it is a monitor which gets deployed at the front of the room with all the capture stuff mounted on the back of it using a VESA mount | 01:25 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Getting HDMI audio working is definitely something which has the potential to be a GSoC project | 01:26 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: and how do you get the captured stream to the video mixer, via something else? | 01:26 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: and h.264 ? | 01:27 |
| krokodilerian | (or theora, or whatever) | 01:27 |
| krokodilerian | i know the codec is hard, but is it possible to port it from something else? | 01:27 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: No, a small Python script streams the MJPEG video to voctomix over Gigabit Ethernet | 01:27 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: or are there licensing issues? | 01:27 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Which BanannaPi boards do you have? | 01:28 |
| krokodilerian | as for mjpeg, if it's below 20mbps, it might be possible to use it for streaming, but we won't be able to record it, i think, the SSDs in the boxes are 64gb | 01:29 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: The MJPEG is roughly ~300megabits/second -- we just record the output of voctomix in our setup | 01:30 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: http://www.bananapi.org/p/product.html - this oke, afaik | 01:30 |
| tpb | Title: Banana Pi - A Highend Single-Board Computer: Banana Pi (at www.bananapi.org) | 01:30 |
| mithro | (about ~30 megabytes/second) | 01:30 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: we record in voctomix, but also on the boxes, as the network might/will fail | 01:31 |
| krokodilerian | and for 300mbps per box/600mbps per room the network people will hate me :) | 01:31 |
| krokodilerian | (or just kill me) | 01:31 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: You don't run voctomix in the room? | 01:32 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: no, voctomixes run in a central place, this year we had 24 laptops, as the primary plan for encoding servers failed, next year we'll go with servers | 01:32 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: i wrote a crude and simple web control for vocto, for the people who wanted to use it, otherwise it was PiP | 01:33 |
| mithro | We always run an in-room network | 01:33 |
| krokodilerian | we have an in-room network, but everything goes out to a central location (or few) | 01:35 |
| krokodilerian | the multicast helps a lot with debugging, too | 01:35 |
| krokodilerian | ( https://github.com/FOSDEM/video/blob/master/Architecture.md explains the architecture) | 01:38 |
| tpb | Title: video/Architecture.md at master · FOSDEM/video · GitHub (at github.com) | 01:38 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: about the codec, is it possible to do anything, or are there licensing issues which nobody wants to touch? | 01:39 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: Its non-trivial amount of work, IE a good engineer multiple months of work | 01:39 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: so, to recap, currently the audio is an interesting project, and maybe the vga, what else would be doable in gsoc? | 01:42 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: anyway, i really need to go to bed, can you drop me a line what should i propose to the students to propose as projects, and i'll talk to them tomorrow | 01:54 |
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| CarlFK | mithro: the /topic here needs fixing. mainly add https://code.timvideos.us/summer-of-code/ | 02:10 |
| mithro | CarlFK: Have you tried fixing it? | 02:23 |
| CarlFK | (08:24:27 PM) You're not a channel operator | 02:32 |
| CarlFK | here is my try: /topic GSoC: https://code.timvideos.us/summer-of-code/ IRC logs: https://logs.timvideos.us/%23timvideos/latest.log.html Mailing lists - https://groups.google.com/group/timvideos Website - http://code.timvideos.us | 02:33 |
| tpb | Title: Google Groups (at groups.google.com) | 02:33 |
| *** mithro sets mode: +o CarlFK | 02:33 | |
| *** CarlFK changes topic to " GSoC: https://code.timvideos.us/summer-of-code/ IRC logs: https://logs.timvideos.us/%23timvideos/latest.log.html Mailing lists - https://groups.google.com/group/timvideos Website - http://code.timvideos.us" | 02:36 | |
| CarlFK | done | 02:36 |
| CarlFK | https://code.timvideos.us/projects/ links to gst-swtich - can that be removed? | 02:39 |
| CarlFK | eventstreamer was pretty tied to DVswitch - so I think that can go too | 02:39 |
| mithro | CarlFK: https://github.com/timvideos/website | 02:39 |
| tpb | Title: GitHub - timvideos/website: The code.timvideos.us website (at github.com) | 02:39 |
| CarlFK | mithro: should I remove references to gst-switch or replace with a link to vocto? | 02:42 |
| mithro | CarlFK: replace with vocto | 02:52 |
| xfxf | mithro: https://theoutline.com/post/1166/programmers-are-confessing-their-coding-sins-to-protest-a-broken-job-interview-process | 04:27 |
| tpb | Title: Programmers are confessing their coding sins to protest a broken job interview process | The Outline (at theoutline.com) | 04:27 |
| xfxf | from that article: “Hello, my name is Tim. I’m a lead at Google with over 30 years coding experience and I need to look up how to get length of a python string,” | 04:27 |
| xfxf | is that you? did you forget len()? :P | 04:27 |
| xfxf | (micolous_ said it was you) | 04:28 |
| mithro | Nope | 04:34 |
| xfxf | suuuureeee | 04:34 |
| mithro | I didn't start coding at age 3 :-P | 04:35 |
| xfxf | i started in basic at age 4, and then pascal when 6 or 7... which begs the question of what the hell happened :P | 05:09 |
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| mithro | xfxf: ping? | 05:46 |
| xfxf | pong | 05:46 |
| mithro | xfxf: Do you want to add HDMI2USB control software and/or HDMI2USBd improvements to the GSoC ideas page? | 05:48 |
| xfxf | ah, sure, can do. is that from the GSoC admin thing? | 05:48 |
| mithro | xfxf: Anyone can do that, it's just GitHub | 05:49 |
| mithro | https://github.com/timvideos/getting-started/issues | 05:49 |
| tpb | Title: Issues · timvideos/getting-started · GitHub (at github.com) | 05:49 |
| xfxf | right, so link back to the actual related issue on the right repo? | 05:50 |
| xfxf | i'll add to my TODO, won't do now | 05:50 |
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| mithro | Click new and follow the template | 05:50 |
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| mithro | tumbleweed: Do you want to take another look at https://github.com/timvideos/HDMI2USB-mode-switch/pull/54 ? | 06:49 |
| tpb | Title: Add --reset-gateware by mithro · Pull Request #54 · timvideos/HDMI2USB-mode-switch · GitHub (at github.com) | 06:49 |
| mithro | Hi ssk1328 | 06:55 |
| ssk1328 | mithro: Hi | 07:03 |
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| mithro | ssk1328: I just replied to your reply with some questions | 07:06 |
| ssk1328 | mithro: I will get back to you with the replies by later tonight | 07:07 |
| mithro | ssk1328: Thanks! | 07:07 |
| ssk1328 | mithro: WIll have to do a lot of catching up on those things | 07:07 |
| mithro | ssk1328: No worries | 07:07 |
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| krokodilerian | mithro: morning | 08:33 |
| mithro | krokodilerian: morning | 08:34 |
| krokodilerian | mithro: so, audio and vga for proposals ? | 08:44 |
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