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| SeriousWorm | hello, your site doesn't work with opera | 03:55 |
|---|---|---|
| SeriousWorm | http://i.imgur.com/wjbiR.png | 03:55 |
| SeriousWorm | I've just painfully completed the GSOC signup form after disabling CSS and fixing about 20 different errors, which I had to manually hunt down via source code .. | 03:56 |
| SeriousWorm | for example the signup form doesn't allow periods (.) in the address field, so for example Ul. br. Ivancic (St. of the Ivanic brothers or similar..) isn't accepted | 03:57 |
| SeriousWorm | basically the signup form is some sort of IQ test? | 03:57 |
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| leumas | in the idea for GCI : "Better Google Code-in module", 'Queuing system for student claim requests' am I supposed to improve the queuing system or should I implement it starting from scratch?? pls help me | 04:07 |
| leumas | SRabbelier: pls help me :) | 04:11 |
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| leumas | can ne1 help me?? | 05:06 |
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| dol-sen | I think I found a bug in the scoring | 05:43 |
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| dol-sen | If you hit the remove score button for a proposal that you haven't added a score yet, it still changes the score/average | 05:52 |
| dol-sen | fortunately, in my case it was a spam proposal anyway | 05:52 |
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| leumas | help with the queuing system in GCI | 05:56 |
| leumas | do I need to implement the queues or should I need to improve the already existing ones? | 05:56 |
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| leumas | guys! pls help me!! | 05:57 |
| hypatia | leumas: you should ask the project | 06:03 |
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| leumas_ | hypatia: and where can I find it? | 06:06 |
| leumas_ | i mean, how should I contact them? | 06:06 |
| hypatia | leumas_: which project is it? | 06:10 |
| leumas_ | the melange one: building a better GCI module | 06:11 |
| hypatia | i see... my apologies then, you're in the right place :) | 06:14 |
| hypatia | just be a bit patient, leumas_ - they may be asleep | 06:14 |
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| leumas | thanx for the advice hypatia! | 07:35 |
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| antimatroid | thrain42: are you about? | 10:26 |
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| leumas | need help with the queuing system in GCI | 10:52 |
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| leumas | nebody awake ? | 12:20 |
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| leumas | need help with the queuing system in GCI, pls ne1?? | 12:29 |
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| kai | SRabbelier|Lappy: can you take my co-admin off the notifications list on gsoc.appspot.com? :) | 13:11 |
| kai | hi, btw :) | 13:11 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | kai: no | 13:13 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | kai: he should do that himself :P | 13:13 |
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| gevaerts | kai: you can send an email to SRabbelier|Lappy with the From: set to the co-admin's email address and ask to change the google account the link_id is connected to :) | 13:30 |
| kai | hehe | 13:31 |
| kai | hm, I could even send it from the correct server ;) | 13:31 |
| * SRabbelier|Lappy chortles | 13:31 | |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | gevaerts: I don't do that kind of fixes for gsoc.appspot.com though | 13:32 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | gevaerts: I just tell people to register a new account :P | 13:32 |
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| thrain42 | antimatroid: I'm always idling, sometimes at the screen, but for melange I'm not much help most of the time | 13:42 |
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| SRabbelier|Lappy | someoene tell leumas to mail the mailing list when he drops in next time | 13:43 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: what's up with thrain42? | 13:43 |
| durin42 | SRabbelier|Lappy: when my connection flaps, I become thrain42 | 13:46 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | curious | 13:46 |
| durin42 | durin42 durin42_ thrain42 thorin42 thrain42_ and samwise_gamgee are all mine. | 13:47 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | samwise_gamgee, really? hhah :D | 13:47 |
| durin42 | I hope you detect my theme. | 13:47 |
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| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: indeed | 13:48 |
| durin42 | I'm curious why my connection dropped though. | 13:49 |
| durin42 | My monitoring didn't catch even so much as a high latency window. | 13:49 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: you seem to be missing Telchar42 though | 13:49 |
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| SRabbelier|Lappy | hehe :) | 13:50 |
| telchar42 | Fixed. | 13:50 |
| *** telchar42 is now known as durin42 | 13:50 | |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: how about thror42? | 13:50 |
| durin42 | Sigh. | 13:50 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | heheh :P | 13:51 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | well! | 13:51 |
| durin42 | At some point it just gets absurd. | 13:51 |
| durin42 | telchar is obscure enough to be worth keeping. | 13:51 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Middle-earth_Dwarves#Thr.C3.A1in_II | 13:51 |
| tpb | Title: List of Middle-earth Dwarves - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at en.wikipedia.org) | 13:51 |
| durin42 | Sigh. | 13:51 |
| durin42 | I didn't need that. | 13:51 |
| durin42 | BTW, my monitoring software for the house I call mazarbul. | 13:52 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: your house has monitoring software? | 13:52 |
| durin42 | :) | 13:52 |
| durin42 | Right now it's just monitoring network things | 13:52 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | ah :) | 13:53 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | fair enough then | 13:53 |
| durin42 | but I do want to get a microcontroller in the garage so it can fire an alert if the garage door is open too long, or similar. | 13:53 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: make one for the fridge :P | 13:53 |
| durin42 | that sounds like actual hard work | 13:53 |
| durin42 | and not so valuable | 13:53 |
| durin42 | Totally unrelated, I need to pick your brain at some point about .gitignore. | 13:54 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: again? :) | 13:54 |
| durin42 | _.gitignore_ | 13:55 |
| durin42 | not the index. | 13:55 |
| durin42 | I've got a hacky workaround for my index woes for now. | 13:55 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: I thought you already did that too :P | 13:56 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: but feel free | 13:56 |
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| durin42 | No, I started ignore support last night | 13:57 |
| durin42 | mostly, I'm curious how foo/.gitignore alters things | 13:57 |
| durin42 | (in hg we only have the top-level hgignore file) | 13:57 |
| durin42 | If there's a *.pyc in foo/.gitignore, will that ignore bar/foo.pyc? | 13:58 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: you mean order of preference? | 13:58 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: no, ofc not :) | 13:58 |
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| durin42 | No, I'm going to be compiling them all down to a single regexp before any ignoring action happens | 13:58 |
| durin42 | (Well, actually I'm going to consolidate things down to a set of rules I emit into hg's ignore machinery, which does the regexp conversion for me) | 13:59 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: then you should probably be fine with prefixing the values with an anchored directory name | 13:59 |
| durin42 | Yeah, something like that. | 13:59 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: so "*.pyc" in foo/.gitignore turns in to "/foo/*.pyc" | 13:59 |
| durin42 | That's what I was planning on | 13:59 |
| durin42 | Ah, not quite. | 13:59 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: assuming that also ignores /foo/bar/*.pyc | 13:59 |
| durin42 | foo/.gitignore's *.pyc needs to be something like re:^foo.*/.*\.pyc | 14:00 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: that should work | 14:00 |
| durin42 | I've got top-level .gitignores working though | 14:00 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: neat | 14:00 |
| durin42 | and I'm just building out features as I need them | 14:00 |
| durin42 | I'm lazy and don't want to write the directory-walking code yet. | 14:00 |
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| SRabbelier|Lappy | durin42: heheh, you lazy dog ;) | 14:01 |
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| durin42 | The three principal virtues of a programmer are Laziness, Impatience, and Hubris. See the Camel Book for why. | 14:01 |
| durin42 | -- perl(1) | 14:01 |
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| praveen97uma | <@SRabbelier> Hi Sverre ! | 15:06 |
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| praveen97uma | SRabbelier : we require more number of tests to be written for SoC framework and not specifically for gsoc modules | 15:09 |
| leumas | SRabbelier: can you please tell me where I can find these 'mailing lists' ? | 15:10 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | leumas: the melange mailing list? | 15:12 |
| leumas | SRabbelier|Lappy: yeah! | 15:12 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | praveen97uma: I'm nost ure I understand what you said | 15:12 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | leumas: did you check our wiki? | 15:13 |
| leumas | SRabbelier|Lappy: yes, but I didn't find any | 15:13 |
| leumas | SRabbelier|Lappy: can you pls give me the link? | 15:13 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | leumas: no | 15:14 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | leumas: if you can't find our mailing list from http://code.google.com/p/soc/w/list then I can't help you either | 15:14 |
| tpb | Title: Wiki Pages - soc - SoC (Spice of Creation) - Google Project Hosting (at code.google.com) | 15:14 |
| leumas | SRabbelier|Lappy: okay.. | 15:14 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | leumas: we expect a certain degree of self-sufficiency from our students | 15:14 |
| leumas | SRabbelier|Lappy: I get it .. | 15:15 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | leumas: I thought you might | 15:15 |
| leumas | SRabbelier|Lappy: ya and I just got it! | 15:16 |
| leumas | SRabbelier|Lappy: thanx :) | 15:17 |
| praveen97uma | SRabbelier: regarding the project on testing .. we need more number of tests for the SoC framework so that we can do TDD.. but i have observed most of the development is being done for gsoc modules .. | 15:20 |
| praveen97uma | SRabbelier: I compared the number of tests and the number of modules in the corresponding folders and found that the tests for a significant number of modules yet have to be written for SoC framework | 15:21 |
| praveen97uma | SRabbelier : You have added a number of tests for testing the gsoc modules | 15:22 |
| praveen97uma | so i was in a doubt if the focus of the project is on writing the tests for gsoc modules or the fundamental modules of the SoC framework | 15:24 |
| praveen97uma | @SRabbelier|Lappy:?? | 15:26 |
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| SRabbelier|Lappy | praveen97uma: have you seen the tests in tests/new_views? | 15:31 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | praveen97uma: they should cover most of the new views | 15:31 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | praveen97uma: also notice that everything in soc.{modules.gsoc,modules.gci}.{logic,views}.models will be removed | 15:32 |
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| akashm1990 | Just noticed a minor bug(or maybe feature) | 15:34 |
| akashm1990 | If you type in a proposal id, it will tell you if the proposal exists or not | 15:34 |
| akashm1990 | even if you dont have accesss to that proposal | 15:34 |
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| SRabbelier|Lappy | akashm1990: that's fine | 15:36 |
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| praveen97uma | <@SRabbelier|Lappy> : Am I correct in figuring out from the code of modules in tests/new_views that the tests are for testing the new views for gsoc? | 15:52 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | praveen97uma: right | 15:53 |
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| praveen97uma | <@SRabbelier|Lappy> but the framework is aimed at enabling users to host programs like gsoc and gci, so is the aim of the gsoc project to write tests for app.soc.logic and app.soc.views which are the fundamental part of gsoc and gci modules or testing the new gsoc views? | 16:02 |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | praveen97uma: GSoC testing should focus on soc.modules.gsoc.views, but should of course also test things from soc.views if they are used in soc.modules.gsoc.views | 16:05 |
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| * SRabbelier|Lappy is going home | 16:05 | |
| SRabbelier|Lappy | will bbs | 16:06 |
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| betaVersion | hi everyone, i have posted my idea at the following link, please send your feedback and suggestions : http://groups.google.com/group/melange-soc/browse_thread/thread/55e0925fc08c735d | 18:04 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/8hrq> (at groups.google.com) | 18:04 |
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| kmmurphy | WHO | 19:20 |
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| SRabbelier | kmmurphy: what's the World Health Organization got to do with anything? | 19:21 |
| kmmurphy | ha sorry, I was trying to get a list of people logged on currently | 19:22 |
| kmmurphy | I've never used IRC before | 19:22 |
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| kmmurphy | I know it's a little late in the game, but I'm interested in the testing, and code quality assurance project, I was wondering how detailed the estimated timeline should be? | 19:35 |
| SRabbelier | kmmurphy: week scale I think | 19:38 |
| kmmurphy | Ok, thank you! | 19:45 |
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| gevaerts | dhaun: in this case I'm not sure if a different name for the field would help... | 20:45 |
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| dhaun | gevaerts: :P | 20:45 |
| SRabbelier | beware the troll | 20:45 |
| dhaun | I don't think he's a troll - maybe not GSoC material, though | 20:45 |
| SRabbelier | indeed | 20:46 |
| gevaerts | Accidental trolls can be the most tenacious though | 20:46 |
| |Kev| | I think it should stay as it is. | 20:46 |
| |Kev| | It's clearly a competence test that'll save time for mentors. | 20:47 |
| * gevaerts bets that it's a URL again | 20:53 | |
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| LetterRip | SRabbelier: a potential issue with the current scoring tools is that a worse proposal with many scorers, can beat a good proposal with fewer scorers - ie bad proposal gets 5 1 scores, good proposal gets 1 4 score | 20:55 |
| SRabbelier | LetterRip: we'll add averages to the dashboard thingy too | 20:56 |
| |Kev| | Yes, all-positive summation is completely broken, known issue :) | 20:56 |
| LetterRip | might be good to allow weighting | 20:56 |
| LetterRip | ie our admins we want more weight | 20:56 |
| SRabbelier | LetterRip: patches welcome for that? :) | 20:56 |
| LetterRip | SRabbelier: heh | 20:56 |
| |Kev| | Simply changing from totals to averages fixes most ills. | 20:56 |
| |Kev| | If you want your admins to have more weight, you can tell mentors to only vote 1..3, and let admins vote 1..5 :) | 20:57 |
| SRabbelier | |Kev|: ack | 20:57 |
| LetterRip | the problem with patches is that unless you are a heavy regular user - the marginal cost of figuring it out usually greatly exceeds ones marginal benefit | 20:57 |
| |Kev| | SRabbelier: You saw the numbers I ran a few nights ago on this, right? | 20:57 |
| SRabbelier | |Kev|: did not I don't think? | 20:57 |
| SRabbelier | LetterRip: true :) | 20:58 |
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| SRabbelier | LetterRip: imagine what it's like to be a voluntary contributor ;) | 20:58 |
| |Kev| | Oh, I wrote a short script to treat various student scores under different models. | 20:58 |
| |Kev| | Showed that you can get an almost equivalent model to the one KDE used last year, this year, if averages are the mean measure, and that summation is completely broken. | 20:58 |
| |Kev| | Let me find the scripts | 20:59 |
| |Kev| | Seems it was late Friday night. | 21:00 |
| |Kev| | http://astyanax.doomsong.co.uk/~kismith/nolisting/tmp/nightrose.py.txt | 21:00 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/8grq> (at astyanax.doomsong.co.uk) | 21:00 |
| |Kev| | http://astyanax.doomsong.co.uk/~kismith/nolisting/tmp/nightroseout.txt | 21:00 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/8grr> (at astyanax.doomsong.co.uk) | 21:00 |
| |Kev| | So, the idea there is that KDE last year used three votes, -1, 0 and +1 | 21:01 |
| |Kev| | For negative, meh and positive. | 21:01 |
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| |Kev| | So there you go, now you've seen the pretty numbers too :) | 21:05 |
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| LetterRip | i prefer a -5 to +5 range myself | 21:08 |
| LetterRip | easier to diffentiate between meh and bad proposals | 21:09 |
| LetterRip | and to reduce overrated proposals | 21:09 |
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| |Kev| | LetterRip: Yes, I think the numbers show that allowing negative scores is the best approach, but my understanding was that the design agency that'd prettified Melange had decided that negative scores couldn't be used? | 21:14 |
| LetterRip | well design agencies are used for suggestions, not final decision making :) | 21:15 |
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| |Kev| | At the end of it, as long as averages are used rather than totals, a not-too-terrible approximation can be made. | 21:16 |
| SRabbelier | LetterRip: that is true | 21:16 |
| SRabbelier | The reason we haven't used it is that it's less intiuitive | 21:17 |
| SRabbelier | And FTR | 21:17 |
| SRabbelier | EchoDitto doesn't dictate what the ydo | 21:17 |
| SRabbelier | they suggest things, and if we agree, we implement them :) | 21:17 |
| SRabbelier | just as they suggested we drop negative scores due to it being unitntuitive, and we agreed | 21:18 |
| |Kev| | I stand corrected. | 21:18 |
| gevaerts | But now people complain that the lack of negative scores is unintuitive :) | 21:18 |
| |Kev| | gevaerts: Not unintuitive, unexpressive, I think. | 21:19 |
| gevaerts | |Kev|: well yes, but that didn't sound as good | 21:19 |
| |Kev| | 1-5 Stars is certainly more intuitive to vote with, it just doesn't provide the same sort of ability to score. | 21:19 |
| SRabbelier | |Kev|: yes, but it's easier to interpret the results :) | 21:20 |
| SRabbelier | |Kev|: a 0 score could mean two people voted -5 and 5 in the old system | 21:20 |
| |Kev| | Sure, and a 3 score could mean two people voted 1 and 5 in the new system :) | 21:20 |
| |Kev| | It's easier to interpret the results with 1-5 stars, because there's less scope for expression. | 21:21 |
| |Kev| | I'm not arguing that you should drop the 1-5 star system and go back to negatives, it's a trade-off that you've decided to make, and I think it's possible to live with it. | 21:22 |
| SRabbelier | |Kev|: fair point | 21:23 |
| |Kev| | The numbers were at the time to try and come up with a system for Nightrose so that KDE could meaningfully use the system, and in the process it showed what I'd been previously been claiming, that totals are meaningless and that either the individual scores or the averages are what matters. | 21:23 |
| * SRabbelier nods | 21:24 | |
| SRabbelier | |Kev|: will make adding averages to the dashboard a priority then | 21:24 |
| |Kev| | Thanks very much :) | 21:25 |
| * gevaerts hails SRabbelier's average work! | 21:25 | |
| SRabbelier | lol | 21:25 |
| |Kev| | I note that it *is* possible to use the old KDE system, with 1, 0, 3, to get exactly the same output they had before but it requires a lot of post-processing of the results. | 21:26 |
| * SRabbelier nods | 21:26 | |
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| |Kev| | (You know the totals, and you know the number of votes, so it seems to me off the top of my head that subtracting votecount * -2 from the total should convert to the old negative/positive votesystem. | 21:27 |
| |Kev| | I haven't run those numbers to check I'm not being stupid, though) | 21:27 |
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| Moult | hello folks, I accidentally sent in an application as a mentor as I didn't see the register as a student link, and now my google account is blocked from resigning up as a student. ideas? | 21:31 |
| gevaerts | Moult: talk to SRabbelier | 21:32 |
| Moult | SRabbelier: ping | 21:32 |
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| SRabbelier | Moult: hi | 21:33 |
| Moult | SRabbelier: ^ see above | 21:33 |
| SRabbelier | !learn fix as Send me an email from the account you are registered with on the site, with your link_id, and your desired status change. My email is my nick at gmail. | 21:33 |
| socinfo | SRabbelier: The operation succeeded. | 21:33 |
| SRabbelier | !fix | 21:34 |
| socinfo | SRabbelier: "fix" is Send me an email from the account you are registered with on the site, with your link_id, and your desired status change. My email is my nick at gmail. | 21:34 |
| SRabbelier | Moult: ^ | 21:34 |
| LetterRip | |Kev|: yes it is trivial interconversion | 21:34 |
| gevaerts | SRabbelier: "my nick at gmail" said by socinfo could be interpreted wrongly I guess | 21:34 |
| LetterRip | but some folks prefer differnt interfaces | 21:34 |
| SRabbelier | gevaerts: fair point | 21:34 |
| LetterRip | you can get from one sceme to almost anny others with simple linear transforms | 21:35 |
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| LetterRip | might be useful to just provide an interface for the admin | 21:35 |
| LetterRip | to choose the visual representation and algorithm | 21:36 |
| LetterRip | then it doesn't matter | 21:36 |
| LetterRip | then you can default to the current | 21:36 |
| LetterRip | and store it the same | 21:36 |
| LetterRip | but display and interact based on the admin prefs | 21:36 |
| Moult | SRabbelier: sent :) | 21:36 |
| SRabbelier | gevaerts: he figured it out though | 21:36 |
| |Kev| | LetterRip: Oh, no, there are lots of schemes you can't convert between :) | 21:36 |
| |Kev| | It just happens that KDE's old scheme conveniently can. | 21:37 |
| LetterRip | almost all of the schemes suggested can be trivially interconverted except for mutlitple voting | 21:37 |
| LetterRip | even that can | 21:37 |
| LetterRip | by allowing a bigger range | 21:37 |
| LetterRip | so if i vote 10 -5s for a proposal that is the same as -50 | 21:38 |
| gevaerts | LetterRip: it can't do schulze-condorcet :) | 21:38 |
| LetterRip | then you can rescale that to your zero point | 21:38 |
| LetterRip | gevaerts: hence 'almost all' | 21:38 |
| gevaerts | SRabbelier: yes, well, maybe I'm getting too cynical these days... | 21:39 |
| SRabbelier | gevaerts: possibly | 21:39 |
| SRabbelier | gevaerts: what's that anyway? | 21:39 |
| gevaerts | ? | 21:39 |
| LetterRip | oh well not a huge deal | 21:39 |
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| LetterRip | can work with whatever and make it work | 21:39 |
| Moult | SRabbelier: how will i know when my status has been changed? | 21:43 |
| SRabbelier | Moult: you'll be able to register again | 21:44 |
| SRabbelier | Moult: I'm just deleting your profile | 21:44 |
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| LetterRip | SRabbelier: btw just wanted to thank you and the rest of the team for all the hardwork you guys put into this | 21:58 |
| SRabbelier | LetterRip: thanks so much ^__^ | 21:58 |
| LetterRip | ye | 21:58 |
| LetterRip | yw | 21:58 |
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| orcuna | SRabbelier: Heyy , did you have time for looking my patch? | 23:51 |
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| orcuna | SRabbelier: Heyy , did you have time for looking my patch? | 23:55 |
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