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| -bartol.freenode.net- [freenode-info] if you're at a conference and other people are having trouble connecting, please mention it to staff: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#gettinghelp | 00:00 | |
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| iFire | tansell for tp you just have a large media repo right? | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| tansell | yeah, it's in SVN | 00:00 |
| tansell | it's not that huge, but enough that you don't want to clone the full history on a slower link | 00:01 |
| iFire | my thoughts was if I could not change git | 00:01 |
| iFire | There are three options a) rsync look-alike b) svn c) git shallow clones / submodules. Stuff like rsync look-alike would be a cifs vpn share and backup every 3 hours at the server. Svn would give you the head repository. A git shallow copy cannot be pushed. | 00:01 |
| iFire | tansell so you've decided on svn for the media | 00:02 |
| tansell | iFire, yeah | 00:03 |
| iFire | did you do the trunk tag etc. | 00:03 |
| iFire | or just have one directory | 00:03 |
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| iFire | Pushing from a shallow repository is not supported, but works when you're pushing to branches with a common ancestor in your available history (so pushing to the remote HEAD should always work). | 00:11 |
| iFire | according to git mailing list | 00:11 |
| iFire | tansell how big is the media svn? | 00:13 |
| iFire | in both total repository and checkout | 00:14 |
| tansell | about 2gig in SVN, compresses down to about 1.5g in GIt | 00:14 |
| iFire | wait how does that work? | 00:17 |
| tansell | SVN doesn't really compress stuff very well | 00:21 |
| tansell | git does a much better job | 00:21 |
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| iFire | that's the repo size or the checkout? | 00:26 |
| tansell | well, for git it's the same thing | 00:30 |
| tansell | actually that's not true | 00:30 |
| iFire | a checkout is history + checked out files :/ | 00:30 |
| tansell | a bare repository is smaller then a checkout (which includes the repository plus a copy of HEAD) | 00:31 |
| iFire | I want to know what a bare repository and what is the size of the data files | 00:31 |
| tansell | 1.5G | 00:35 |
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| llnz | bbl | 01:42 |
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| iFire | tansell I'm getting confused. So 2 gig bare svn and 1.5 gig of media files? | 01:52 |
| tansell | 2gig bare svn, 1.5gig bare git | 02:08 |
| iFire | what about the media of the latest version | 02:13 |
| iFire | the total of the latest version | 02:13 |
| tansell | iFire, I'm not sure what you mean? | 02:18 |
| tansell | how big is a checkout? | 02:19 |
| iFire | an svn checkout, git include history | 02:20 |
| iFire | a git checkout includes history and the media | 02:20 |
| iFire | svn's .svn has metadata | 02:20 |
| iFire | but that should be insignificant | 02:20 |
| tansell | iFire, .svn keeps a "clean" copy of every file | 02:22 |
| iFire | it does? | 02:22 |
| tansell | yeah | 02:22 |
| iFire | well without .git or .svn then | 02:22 |
| tansell | so it can do local diffs | 02:22 |
| iFire | that's what I mean with pure media | 02:22 |
| tansell | iFire, you can check this all yourself :) | 02:22 |
| tansell | svn://svn.thousandparsec.net/media | 02:22 |
| iFire | is there a ballpark? | 02:22 |
| iFire | I don't want to download 1g of files | 02:22 |
| ezod | we should help get wombat ready for prime time ;) | 02:30 |
| ezod | http://wiki.worldforge.org/wiki/Wombat | 02:30 |
| tpb | Title: Wombat - WorldForgeWiki (at wiki.worldforge.org) | 02:30 |
| iFire | tansell any idea what this post means? http://markmail.org/search/?q=shallow+push+list%3Aorg.kernel.vger.git+order%3Adate-backward+from%3A%22Junio+C+Hamano%22#query:shallow%20push%20list%3Aorg.kernel.vger.git%20type%3Adevelopment%20order%3Arelevance+page:1+mid:kfdabza7b2pxz27y+state:results | 02:45 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/5KhX> (at markmail.org) | 02:45 |
| tansell | iFire, it's talking about a case where shallow pushing could fail | 02:47 |
| iFire | but I don't understand the case | 03:05 |
| iFire | rewind and rebuild of history? | 03:07 |
| iFire | is that supposed to normal | 03:07 |
| iFire | to be normal* | 03:07 |
| iFire | how does that relate to an average workflow | 03:07 |
| iFire | tansell also I can't svn checkout that link | 03:15 |
| tansell | yeah | 03:16 |
| tansell | it should have been | 03:16 |
| tansell | svn checkout http://svn.thousandparsec.net/svn/media | 03:16 |
| tpb | Title: svn - Revision 72: /media (at svn.thousandparsec.net) | 03:16 |
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| iFire | so far 100 mb | 03:30 |
| tansell | iFire, my numbers are from foggy memories a long time ago | 03:42 |
| iFire | nearing 200mb | 03:43 |
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| CIA-23 | llnz libtprl * r2df3f327246b /tprl/console.cpp: Added stdint.h header | 08:07 |
| CIA-23 | llnz libtprl * r7534f1c479d4 / (ChangeLog configure.ac): Preping for release | 08:29 |
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| null_000 | morning world | 09:01 |
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| CIA-23 | llnz web * r23f24c5cc7ca / (3 files in 3 dirs): Releasing libtprl 0.1.3 | 09:36 |
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| llnz | later all | 10:49 |
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| tansell-laptop | heyo people | 11:36 |
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| andz_ | helloooo everybody :) | 13:55 |
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| iFire | tansell another way of doing shallow pushes is git replace | 14:11 |
| iFire | The name of the replace reference is the SHA1 of the object that is replaced. The content of the replace reference is the SHA1 of the replacement object. | 14:11 |
| iFire | it was added to git 1.5 | 14:11 |
| iFire | instead of storing the files in the repo, you store it elsewhere, but keep the hash | 14:12 |
| iFire | http://progit.org/2010/03/17/replace.html | 14:12 |
| tpb | Title: Pro Git - Replace Kicker (at progit.org) | 14:12 |
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| iFire | second in tread | 14:16 |
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| ezod | are new packages in the web repo automagically put on sourceforge somehow, or do we have to do that manually? | 14:50 |
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| iFire | tansell this mechanism can be used by streaming implementations of git | 15:08 |
| iFire | aka torrent | 15:08 |
| iFire | so the idea is instead of making git store metadata, you store metadata in git and then replace it | 15:34 |
| iFire | with the real objects | 15:34 |
| CIA-23 | mavrinac gentoo-overlay * r6d907e7e8fd9 /dev-libs/libtprl/ (6 files in 2 dirs): Version bump dev-libs/libtprl to 0.1.3. | 15:37 |
| CIA-23 | mavrinac web * re6688651ae19 /downloads/downloads.xml: Update Gentoo version for libtprl download. | 15:38 |
| ezod | issue 87 closed | 15:41 |
| ezod | mithro: any plan to merge tp04 branch of tpclient-pywx yet? | 15:43 |
| CIA-23 | mavrinac daneel-ai * r69cd56009fcc / (TODO daneel-ai daneel_ai.py): Rename daneel_ai.py to daneel-ai and set executable. Fixes singleplayer, breaks profiling stuff. | 16:07 |
| ezod | issue 89 closed | 16:09 |
| CIA-23 | mavrinac daneel-ai * r880dc3a3a4fb / (daneel-ai-inplace.xml daneel-ai.xml.in): Add RFTS to daneel-ai singleplayer rulesets (fixes issue 90). | 16:10 |
| ezod | issue 90 closed | 16:11 |
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| nbdarvin | hi | 16:51 |
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| rrj | hi | 17:59 |
| rrj | my name is rakendu | 17:59 |
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| rrj | i am interested in contributing to thousand Parsec in gsoc | 18:00 |
| rrj | can anyone please help me how i am supposed to proceed | 18:01 |
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| iFire | tansell I think that concept can be redefined as a streaming git repository | 18:17 |
| iFire | so you stream the newest change sets | 18:18 |
| iFire | well download the newest | 18:18 |
| iFire | and then stream the older ones as needed | 18:18 |
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| kerbe | rrj: read this already: http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code | 18:29 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1ffR> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 18:29 |
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| rrj | kerbe: yes i ahve read it. i am interested in the cloning an existing game and universe in an hour idea | 18:31 |
| eqdw | are any devs and/or GSoC mentors around right now? | 18:33 |
| rrj | kerbe: can u plz guide me through it. | 18:34 |
| kerbe | sorry, can't. :) | 18:34 |
| kerbe | I don't have needed knowledge. in fact, I just got server compiled as my bugreport was fixed, so I'm pretty new. :P | 18:35 |
| rrj | kerbe: do u knw anyone who could? | 18:35 |
| kerbe | I'm not even too familiar with GSoC, but I know consept. Just read both that wiki page & GSoC site, seems quite straightforward process | 18:36 |
| kerbe | that wiki has nice list of mentors, and I see quite many are on this channel. so when they're around, I'm sure they pick conversation from backlog. :) | 18:36 |
| eqdw | kerbe: Good point. I'm sure someone'll see my question eventually | 18:36 |
| rrj | kerbe: arent any mentors around right now? | 18:37 |
| eqdw | rrj: my understanding is taht they | 18:37 |
| eqdw | re all on australia time | 18:37 |
| eqdw | making it ~5 AM right now | 18:37 |
| rrj | eqdw: oh ok | 18:37 |
| kerbe | don't know. I joined channel less than half an hour before you rrj. :) | 18:37 |
| rrj | kerbe: :) | 18:37 |
| eqdw | to whichever dev this is relevant for: I'm possibly interested in the battlexml project | 18:37 |
| rrj | no problem thanx anyway | 18:37 |
| kerbe | patience is good virtue in irc. :) | 18:37 |
| kerbe | but note to both of you, reading that wiki & GSoC page, I'm sure they would appreciate if you have some solid proposal written already, it's then easier for them read it through and start discussing how to improve it. :) | 18:39 |
| eqdw | kerbe: I'm not 100% sure on which project I'm interested and I'd like some more details on some of them first | 18:40 |
| rrj | kerbe: u right thnx man | 18:41 |
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| ezod | rrj: i am a mentor | 18:47 |
| rrj | ezod: hi | 18:48 |
| ezod | hello | 18:48 |
| rrj | ezod: i have gone through the list of ideas | 18:48 |
| ezod | we're thinking about prioritizing a few of them for gsoc 2010 | 18:49 |
| ezod | i see you're interested in ruleset development | 18:49 |
| rrj | ezod: yes | 18:49 |
| ezod | i think we're probably more interested in improving an existing one if anything | 18:49 |
| ezod | rather than proliferating rulesets | 18:49 |
| rrj | ezod: can you please tel what is required from my side | 18:50 |
| ezod | what do you mean? | 18:50 |
| eqdw | ezod: I notice you have a ruby library. Is there anything that needs working on in ruby or is that pretty much complete? | 18:50 |
| ezod | eqdw: not sure, i don't know of anything that actually uses the ruby library | 18:51 |
| ezod | looking at git, it seems it hasn't been touched in a long time except for a formatting overhaul | 18:51 |
| eqdw | ezod: yeah I was a little unsure as to why it exists, other than that it does | 18:52 |
| ezod | eqdw: the primary protocol libraries are the python and cpp one | 18:52 |
| ezod | s | 18:52 |
| eqdw | oh I see. libproto-rb in case one makes a Ruby on Rails web client | 18:52 |
| ezod | yes | 18:53 |
| ezod | we do have a web client from gsoc 2009 | 18:53 |
| ezod | but it's in python | 18:53 |
| eqdw | hmm | 18:53 |
| rrj | ezod: i have a good understanding of python and C | 18:53 |
| eqdw | I'd also perhaps be interested int he battlexml support. The synopsis for that is a little small, do you have any insight to add to that? | 18:53 |
| ezod | rrj: cool, those are my pet languages also ;) | 18:53 |
| ezod | eqdw: best person to talk to about that is llnz | 18:54 |
| ezod | balki: ^ how much did you do re: battlexml? | 18:55 |
| eqdw | ezod: He's on aussie time though eh? | 18:55 |
| balki | ??? | 18:55 |
| ezod | yeah (well nz) | 18:55 |
| balki | ezod: yo | 18:55 |
| ezod | balki: did you do anything with battlexml? | 18:55 |
| balki | ezod: message me, quick | 18:55 |
| balki | no | 18:55 |
| ezod | oh ok | 18:55 |
| ezod | eqdw: so llnz then ;) | 18:55 |
| eqdw | k | 18:56 |
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| llnz | ezod: thanks | 19:42 |
| JLP | ahoy everyone | 19:48 |
| llnz | hi JLP | 19:48 |
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| ezod | llnz: we have a prospective gsoc applicant interested in battlexml support | 19:54 |
| rrj | ezod: i have been checking out the ideas list, and i am particualrly interested in clone ruleset idea | 19:54 |
| llnz | ezod: cool | 19:54 |
| ezod | rrj: as i said above, i think we're shying away from new rulesets this year | 19:55 |
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| llnz | hi jiaming, arvind_khadri, null_000 | 20:12 |
| null_000 | hi | 20:12 |
| jiaming | hi | 20:12 |
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| null_000 | I was wondering... on the ideas for programmers page on wiki | 20:21 |
| null_000 | for the AI clients it says "There are many improvements that could be made to these AI. " | 20:22 |
| null_000 | is anything specific meant by this or is it just make-it-better-somehow project | 20:22 |
| null_000 | or is everybody who knows something about this still asleep | 20:23 |
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| llnz | well, obviously the ai's only support a couple of the available game, so they can be extended to support the other games | 20:25 |
| llnz | there are almostly certainly performance improvements to be made, and maybe some better algorithms to be added | 20:25 |
| null_000 | i had a look at both AIs and adding support for more games shouldn't be too hard... | 20:27 |
| null_000 | do you prefer one AI over the other since one is deterministic and one is not (but has its own advantages) | 20:27 |
| null_000 | i could actualy try to add MTSec (and possibly MiniSec) support for both (to see which one works better) but I don't want to give myself too much work (in case the proposal gets excepted) | 20:29 |
| llnz | focusing on one ai client would probably be a good idea | 20:30 |
| ezod | null_000: mtsec support has my vote | 20:30 |
| null_000 | but which one ^_^ | 20:30 |
| null_000 | ezod: thanks | 20:31 |
| ezod | null_000: between daneel and gencon? | 20:31 |
| null_000 | yes | 20:31 |
| ezod | well, i would recommend daneel for a few reasons: | 20:32 |
| ezod | 1. it has had more recent development | 20:32 |
| ezod | 2. it's in python, and python client libs are better supported | 20:32 |
| ezod | 3. it's in python, and more of us know python | 20:32 |
| ezod | adding mtsec support to daneel-ai, and improving daneel along the way, would be a good project, imo | 20:33 |
| ezod | i'm not really familiar with the core design (i know zero about game ai) but if it's sound, daneel could be our flagship ai client after that | 20:34 |
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| ezod | balki did the most recent work on mtsec | 20:36 |
| null_000 | i think daneel-ai has only one big dissadvantage | 20:36 |
| ezod | fyi | 20:36 |
| null_000 | AI rules aren't coded in python | 20:36 |
| null_000 | but in scheme I think | 20:36 |
| null_000 | and a lot of people don't know scheme and the way you have to program in it | 20:37 |
| null_000 | (I personally don't know scheme but I know prolog and that should do it) | 20:37 |
| null_000 | btw thanks for the info | 20:37 |
| ezod | null_000: verhoevenv originally designed daneel-ai | 20:38 |
| ezod | ~seen verhoevenv | 20:38 |
| tpb | ezod: verhoevenv was last seen in #tp 3 days, 0 hours, 16 minutes, and 38 seconds ago: <verhoevenv> Don't think anyone did the integration from the previous SoC-project... | 20:38 |
| ezod | anyway, you can always propose to change how it works if you think there is a benefit | 20:39 |
| null_000 | I guess I'll have to ambush him with questions when he comes back ^_^ | 20:39 |
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| ezod | null_000: i'd recommend poking him by email to make sure you catch him | 20:40 |
| ezod | the earlier you discuss these ideas the more solid your proposal will be come game time | 20:40 |
| ezod | there was also some work done on daneel-ai during last year's SoC, but iirc it didn't pan out... | 20:41 |
| null_000 | what was it? | 20:41 |
| ezod | null_000: i don't recall exactly, but i just broke whatever it was today to fix a more urgent bug ;) | 20:43 |
| ezod | some profiling stuff | 20:43 |
| null_000 | you think I might find the proposal on TP wiki? | 20:44 |
| ezod | 1 sec, i'll see if i can track it down | 20:45 |
| ezod | actually brb | 20:46 |
| null_000 | tyt | 20:47 |
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| ezod | null_000: doesn't appear to be on the wiki, checking if it's still in google's system | 20:52 |
| llnz | null_000, ezod: this branch of daneel-ai: http://git.thousandparsec.net/gitweb/gitweb.cgi?p=daneel-ai.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/pyconstraint-1.1 | 20:53 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/5L-b> (at git.thousandparsec.net) | 20:53 |
| JLP | null_000: http://pastebin.com/2cpxBTYc | 20:54 |
| tpb | Title: Title: Thousand Parsec pytho - Anonymous - 2cpxBTYc - Pastebin.com (at pastebin.com) | 20:54 |
| ezod | llnz: oh, heh, i forgot about that :) | 20:54 |
| ezod | llnz: but the student was not successful? | 20:55 |
| llnz | no, failed end of gsoc (went missing after midterm) | 20:55 |
| null_000 | thanks ^_^ | 20:55 |
| ezod | llnz: that's what i thought, the flurry of commits on august 17 threw me off for a second | 20:56 |
| null_000 | does anyone know if the work was any good before he gone missing? | 20:56 |
| ezod | null_000: verhoevenv would be the best person to ask | 20:57 |
| llnz | JLP: thanks for the link, that's the proposal | 20:57 |
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| null_000 | I think I'll email him when I'm done reading this | 20:58 |
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| null_000 | anyone for a game of MiniSec against a newbee such as myself (if I'm going to code an AI I might try to learn to play the game properly) | 21:11 |
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| jiaming | hi, i want to propose a great idea for the gsoc, to whom should i talk? | 22:16 |
| llnz | jiaming: depends on the area, but either here or the mailing list could be a good place to start | 22:17 |
| jiaming | it's about a battleship creator and extension of the existing rule set | 22:18 |
| llnz | which ruleset? | 22:19 |
| llnz | what programming langage/server? | 22:19 |
| jiaming | i write a draft proposal in Doc, maybe I send it to the mailing list as an attachment | 22:19 |
| llnz | doc (as in MS Word document) is probably not a good idea | 22:20 |
| jiaming | the programming language is python | 22:20 |
| llnz | a page on the wiki is a better idea | 22:20 |
| jiaming | oh.. i see | 22:21 |
| jiaming | okay, i'll put it on the wiki | 22:21 |
| jiaming | but should I discuss it with someone first before i put it on? | 22:22 |
| llnz | sure, i'm the main server developer | 22:23 |
| jiaming | i'm sorry, but the problem is that it's a bit complicated to say it in a few words.. maybe I put it on the wiki and you take a look at it first | 22:24 |
| jiaming | then we can discuss it | 22:24 |
| llnz | sure | 22:27 |
| llnz | there is now a page to link your proposals from on the wiki: http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Proposals2010 | 22:27 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/5LBa> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 22:27 |
| jiaming | but where should i put the actual document? since this page is only for the links | 22:36 |
| llnz | add a slash after the url and put slash then your name , ie: http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Proposals2010/Jiaming | 22:41 |
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| null_000 | bye everyone | 22:58 |
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| jiaming | hi i've put up my proposal on http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Proposals2010/Jiaming | 23:05 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/5LCs> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 23:05 |
| jiaming | and also add a link on http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Proposals2010 | 23:06 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/5LBa> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 23:06 |
| llnz | jiaming: looking now | 23:07 |
| jiaming | excited ^^ | 23:07 |
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| llnz | jiaming: do you want comments on here, at the bottom of your proposal page or on the discussion page? | 23:11 |
| jiaming | maybe just at the proposal page | 23:11 |
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| perfect-rational | Hi | 23:21 |
| llnz | hi perfect-rational | 23:22 |
| llnz | jiaming: comment added | 23:24 |
| jiaming | okay i'll read it. thanks! | 23:25 |
| perfect-rational | Which of the projects listed on your Ideas for Programmers page participate in the GSoC 2010? | 23:28 |
| llnz | perfect-rational: all of them | 23:29 |
| llnz | all of them are a possibilty | 23:29 |
| perfect-rational | Im a student programmer and Im quite interested in the AI client idea. | 23:30 |
| perfect-rational | Im quite good at C++ and Im really love AI. | 23:31 |
| perfect-rational | s/Im really/I really/ | 23:31 |
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| perfect-rational | I was wandering if you could give me some additional info on this project. | 23:33 |
| perfect-rational | I hope this is the right place for this kind of questions. I couldnt find any mentoring information for the project, so I assumed I could ask here. However, I wouldn't want to disrupt your work or anything. | 23:38 |
| llnz | sure, here is fine | 23:45 |
| llnz | the current ai clients are written in python and java | 23:46 |
| llnz | our preference is for people to extend them, but if a suitably advanced proposal was submitted we would consider a new ai client | 23:47 |
| llnz | if you plan to use C++, you should read up on libtpproto-cpp, and maybe help get it to a state where it will actually do orders and messages | 23:48 |
| perfect-rational | I know java. I could extend the java client. | 23:50 |
| llnz | that could be a good idea | 23:50 |
| llnz | it would be a good idea to read up about it | 23:51 |
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| jiaming | llnz: i've read your comments. i'll think about it and maybe discuss about it tomorrow | 23:56 |
| jiaming | and thanks for your comment | 23:57 |
| llnz | jiaming: sure | 23:57 |
| llnz | no problem | 23:57 |
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