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| sttwister | Merio: ready for the meeting :) | 14:04 |
|---|---|---|
| Merio | sttwister: sorry didn't see you, pong in 2 minutes :P | 14:06 |
| sttwister | Merio: sure | 14:07 |
| Merio | sttwister: going to read your latest additions to the wiki | 14:09 |
| Merio | sttwister: ok done :) | 14:10 |
| sttwister | so, what's first ? | 14:10 |
| Merio | Hmm I think we should talk about what you've written in the wiki | 14:11 |
| Merio | First of all, have you seen Sverre's comment on your wiki change? | 14:11 |
| Merio | sttwister: ^^ | 14:12 |
| sttwister | ahh, nope. I don't see any comment :/ | 14:12 |
| Merio | Well, so I would take the opportunity to suggest you to subscribe to project feeds | 14:13 |
| sttwister | will do | 14:14 |
| sttwister | in the meanwhile, I can't even find a link to changes or wiki history | 14:14 |
| Merio | I'm not sure there is one available | 14:15 |
| Merio | However, beside project feeds | 14:15 |
| sttwister | also, is there any way to filter the feed ? | 14:16 |
| Merio | there are two google groups more, the commits mailing list for example is very important to keep updates also on comments about commits (like yours) | 14:16 |
| Merio | Filter based on what? | 14:16 |
| sttwister | e.g. I'd like to have a feed showing only comments to my wiki | 14:17 |
| Merio | However this is the comment from Sverre, which is really very interesting :) | 14:17 |
| Merio | http://groups.google.com/group/melange-soc-commits/browse_thread/thread/2d34c2dc192efd04 | 14:17 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/6iqk> (at groups.google.com) | 14:17 |
| Merio | Hmm I don't think it can be done easily | 14:17 |
| Merio | Maybe subscribing to melange-soc-commits and using some sort of gmail filter | 14:17 |
| sttwister | oh, it's actually a comment to a commit | 14:18 |
| Merio | There are two types of comments on wikis actually, this can be confusing a bit | 14:18 |
| sttwister | yes I understand now | 14:18 |
| Merio | When you change something in the wiki you're actually somewhat "committing" to the repository | 14:19 |
| Merio | So there can be comments on your wiki "commit" | 14:19 |
| Merio | And comments on your wiki "page" | 14:19 |
| Merio | (which you can find in melange-soc-issues google group) | 14:19 |
| sttwister | yes, I didn't know wiki updates go into the repository, heh :) | 14:19 |
| Merio | Yup actually I don't know how to see them in regular interface, I just receive updates with melange-soc-issues and melange-soc-commits emails | 14:20 |
| Merio | oh well, there is a "repository" select box | 14:20 |
| Merio | found it now | 14:21 |
| Merio | http://code.google.com/p/soc/source/browse?repo=wiki | 14:21 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/6irA> (at code.google.com) | 14:21 |
| sttwister | aha I see | 14:21 |
| Merio | so here all revisions of your page | 14:21 |
| Merio | http://code.google.com/p/soc/source/list?path=/GSoC2010DataSeeder.wiki&repo=wiki&r=7fd1edb157310f0ceda53e9757368cfc9e691b28 | 14:21 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/6irI> (at code.google.com) | 14:21 |
| sttwister | too bad you can't actually see them rendered | 14:22 |
| sttwister | anyway, I guess I'll look into offline tasks and see if there should be any difference between working locally and remotely for seeding | 14:22 |
| Merio | Yes you should, first action item then ^__^ | 14:23 |
| Merio | This is very lucky, it would have been a major problem for your project | 14:24 |
| sttwister | indeed, I should also have to find out if this changes anything about the Python fixture generation script idea that I have posted on the wiki | 14:25 |
| Merio | why should it change something? | 14:26 |
| sttwister | I was thinking that there might be a way to export data from the datastore to a Python fixture directly, rather than generating the fixture file from scratch | 14:27 |
| Merio | That could be cool | 14:27 |
| sttwister | now since there's no need for a script to seed data locally, this might be easier and less error-prone | 14:27 |
| Merio | Hmm I think I'm not getting your point | 14:28 |
| sttwister | Let me try and explain this | 14:28 |
| Merio | You mean you can for example seed the DB randomly and for example I see... "wow with these data the statistics module explodes, let's generate a fixture from this DB"? | 14:28 |
| Merio | Something like that? | 14:29 |
| sttwister | yes that's exactly what I mean | 14:29 |
| sttwister | instead of having a script that actually *generates* the fixture (i.e. writing to a file) | 14:29 |
| sttwister | instead of generating using the configuration file | 14:30 |
| Merio | However this should be discussed with the community too I guess | 14:32 |
| Merio | (action item for Monday conf call ^_^) | 14:32 |
| sttwister | noted :) | 14:32 |
| Merio | This is very important to discuss, because we're trying to switch to TDD | 14:32 |
| Merio | And in some way this should fit together with Leo's work on testing | 14:33 |
| sttwister | yep, I guess fixtures will play a very big role, so we have to do this right | 14:33 |
| Merio | Great then | 14:33 |
| Merio | So about your web interface workflow... | 14:35 |
| Merio | I'm guessing that you're not thinking about having direct interaction with the seeder step by step, but use the web interface to build the JSON interactively and then give the final JSON to the script to actually seed the data | 14:36 |
| Merio | I'm not getting if this is meant to be an iterating process (now I seed students, then I seed mentors) or a one-step proces | 14:36 |
| Merio | process | 14:36 |
| sttwister | yes, and then do some regular polling to check the progress and display it to the user, I forgot to mention this | 14:36 |
| sttwister | I was thinking of a one-step process | 14:37 |
| sttwister | I believe it's easier to handle all the relations this way | 14:37 |
| Merio | I don't know if you can poll to display a progress, IIRC task API doesn't give you this sort of information | 14:37 |
| Merio | Maybe you can just say "this task has started" and *maybe* "this task has finished" | 14:37 |
| sttwister | Perhaps something like "this task has started", "Finished seeding students", "Finished seeding proposals" etc | 14:39 |
| sttwister | if it's possible | 14:39 |
| Merio | This one-step vs progressive seeding might need to be discussed with the community | 14:40 |
| Merio | The seed_many written by Sverre was meant to be progressive, the data seeder exposed a sort of "API" callable from HTML | 14:40 |
| Merio | progressive I mean incremental | 14:40 |
| sttwister | ok, maybe this is material more suitable to the dev list rather then the conference call ? | 14:41 |
| Merio | I think so, please write this today so there is the weekend to discuss | 14:42 |
| Merio | Also I find the web interface a little bit limited | 14:42 |
| Merio | I mean it seems not to deal with timeline and/or with "objectives" (like... seed my DB to see the org home page map) | 14:43 |
| Merio | Even though this might be dealt with predefined JSONs | 14:43 |
| Merio | Loadable or copy/pastable | 14:43 |
| sttwister | well, most of these requirements are configurable, which is a one-time task | 14:44 |
| sttwister | once a predefined configuration as been created by someone, anyone can use it | 14:44 |
| Merio | So we have a predefined JSON to seed the DB until "midterm surveys" | 14:45 |
| Merio | either with random data and/or fixed data (fixtures) | 14:46 |
| Merio | Like this? | 14:46 |
| sttwister | yes | 14:46 |
| Merio | Sounds sensible | 14:47 |
| sttwister | and the JSON would include time deltas relative to the current time rather than absolute values, to make sure everything is in the supposed time frame | 14:47 |
| Merio | Cool | 14:47 |
| Merio | Then in my mind there should be something that the backend outputs (in JSON?) after its analysis of the DB to be displayed in the Ajaxy frontend | 14:48 |
| Merio | And maybe some automatic check of compatibility between the predefined JSONs and the actual state of the DB schema to check if they're outdated | 14:48 |
| Merio | Might be easy to do once you do everything with your "data providers" | 14:49 |
| Merio | If your coding is clever enough for the data providers to be easy inspectable using reflection than you can gather compatibility data automatically and see if everything matches easily | 14:50 |
| Merio | Maybe I'm flying to high but this could be interesting for easy maintenability | 14:50 |
| Merio | s/to/too | 14:50 |
| sttwister | Ok, so you mean something like "Warning: field X is not seeded", or "Error: field y doesn't exist in model Y" ? | 14:50 |
| Merio | Yes something like that | 14:51 |
| sttwister | that shouldn't be too hard to do | 14:51 |
| Merio | Maybe this could be a separate script that runs once you get into the data seeder page | 14:51 |
| Merio | So you do everything server side and communicate to the client if there are incompatible JSONs | 14:52 |
| Merio | Because my best guess is that you have all JSON read by the server, because it's not easy to get directory files info in Javascript | 14:52 |
| Merio | I mean this is something that can be easily done in Firefox but then it's not easy to port | 14:53 |
| Merio | to other browsers as well... so yeah, the backend should send all the JSONs configuration info to the client | 14:53 |
| sttwister | I was thinking of actually uploading the JSON to the server | 14:53 |
| Merio | Well as first step don't deal with updating JSON, just read from the backend in a predefined directory and then send simple info like name of file and title/content to the GUI | 14:54 |
| Merio | Then when you click on some file the JSON is downloaded ajaxy way, parsed in the JavaScript and displayed in the GUI | 14:54 |
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| Merio | Makes sense to you? | 14:55 |
| sttwister | why would you query the server for the JSON since JSONs files are generated by the web interface locally (with some AJAX interaction with the server) | 14:56 |
| Merio | for "displayed" I mean you don't see the actual JSON file but the GUI is properly changed to display in a user friendly way what it's in the JSON | 14:56 |
| sttwister | yes, I understand that | 14:56 |
| Merio | you might want to store them, no? | 14:57 |
| sttwister | but that should also work for user, local files | 14:57 |
| sttwister | tbh, I didn't think of that | 14:57 |
| Merio | Yes, by server I mean your local instance | 14:57 |
| Merio | You have predefined JSONs (like "midterm surveys") | 14:58 |
| Merio | And then you can build a configuration from scratch | 14:58 |
| Merio | If you build a configuration from scratch you can save it, yes | 14:58 |
| Merio | But this is done by sending the JSON to the currently running instance and saved on your local filesystem by the python end | 14:58 |
| Merio | So you can then easily commit the new file | 14:59 |
| sttwister | ok, and what happens on GAE ? Should files be stored as BLOBs somewhere ? | 14:59 |
| sttwister | or should this be a local-only feature ? | 14:59 |
| Merio | The file should be stored somewhere in the HG repository (so in your local filesystem) | 15:00 |
| Merio | I mean in the filesystem, if it's ran remotely than it can be done anyway | 15:00 |
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| Merio | I don't know if you can create files on GAE | 15:00 |
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| sttwister | I don't think you can | 15:01 |
| Merio | for some security reason, that I don't know | 15:01 |
| Merio | Well so you can store them in a simple string (no need for BLOB), like we did in the statistics module | 15:01 |
| antarus | storing local files would be way too dangerous ;) | 15:02 |
| Merio | antarus: yep it's reasonable ^^ | 15:02 |
| sttwister | So then, would the JSON files be deployed to GAE too ? | 15:03 |
| sttwister | so a user wanting to seed a live instance would just select a file from a list rather than uploading | 15:03 |
| Merio | sttwister: developer list ftw :P | 15:03 |
| Merio | I mean in my mind you should have both options | 15:03 |
| Merio | I would prefer some physical file for predefined JSONs so we can track changes | 15:04 |
| Merio | I mean otherwise they're not available when you checkout the code | 15:04 |
| Merio | Can't you read from the file system as well? | 15:05 |
| sttwister | well, there's nothing stopping the files for being in the repository, but not deployed to GAE | 15:05 |
| Merio | I mean maybe when the data seeder starts it can load all JSON files from a directory and store them in a model | 15:05 |
| sttwister | I think that is possible | 15:05 |
| Merio | So well there are many options here | 15:06 |
| sttwister | yes, we'll see what others have to say as well | 15:06 |
| Merio | Yup dev list :D | 15:06 |
| Merio | Then I think we're done if you don't have any questions or something more to discuss about | 15:07 |
| Merio | I'm looking forward for the mockups :) | 15:07 |
| sttwister | I'd like to talk to you about what to do next | 15:07 |
| sttwister | I'll do the mockups | 15:08 |
| sttwister | and perhaps some UML use case for the workflow, just to have a clearer image | 15:08 |
| Merio | yes I'm all for it | 15:08 |
| Merio | If you can give further thoughts on the JSON configuration and the data provider that would be cool too | 15:08 |
| sttwister | ok, I'll provide more info on that | 15:09 |
| sttwister | I'll try to post a detailed timeline with weekly milestones | 15:09 |
| sttwister | and then I guess I should start coding, right? :) | 15:09 |
| Merio | Yes Monday it's your first day! | 15:10 |
| Merio | s/it's/is | 15:10 |
| sttwister | I'll probably also post an overview of the module structure for review | 15:10 |
| sttwister | is that ok ? | 15:10 |
| Merio | yes sounds good | 15:11 |
| sttwister | i.e. the files and directory structures | 15:11 |
| Merio | Don't forget the blog post ;) | 15:11 |
| Merio | (today ;)) | 15:11 |
| sttwister | yes, I'll post it today! | 15:11 |
| sttwister | :) | 15:11 |
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| Merio | So well, I'll be around in the next hours (maybe until 20:00 your time) and afterwards I'll be online on GTalk with mobile phone, so feel free to contact me any moment | 15:12 |
| sttwister | ok sure | 15:13 |
| Merio | (oh and update the wiki with the meeting notes too ;)) | 15:13 |
| sttwister | well then, I guess that's it | 15:13 |
| sttwister | yep, I'm doing it as we speak | 15:13 |
| Merio | Great strategy ;) | 15:13 |
| sttwister | :) | 15:14 |
| sttwister | see you later then | 15:14 |
| sttwister | bye! | 15:14 |
| Merio | see you, bye! | 15:14 |
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