| *** tpb has joined #tp | 00:00 | |
| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o tpb | 00:00 | |
| nash | Landon: submit ;-) | 00:06 |
|---|---|---|
| Landon | nash, trying, trying | 00:06 |
| Landon | the melange editor isn't accepting my pastes :P | 00:06 |
| Landon | so far I've only been able to get the abstract in | 00:06 |
| * nash has NFI... sorry can't help | 00:07 | |
| nash | but there is a report bug button ;-) | 00:07 |
| Landon | got it! | 00:09 |
| Landon | going to include a few more things then submitting :) | 00:11 |
| nash | you can update | 00:16 |
| Landon | doh, my abstract is >500 chars | 00:21 |
| Landon | nash: submitted | 00:22 |
| nash | Landon: if the page ever reloads... I'll let you know | 00:23 |
| nash | yep... cool | 00:25 |
| *** llnz has joined #tp | 01:01 | |
| jnengland77 | Wow I have no wiki skills... | 01:21 |
| jnengland77 | llnz: if you wouldn't mind looking at my proposal and provide some feedback when you get on that would be good. | 01:21 |
| jnengland77 | http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/GSoC-jnengland77 | 01:21 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/35Gu> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 01:21 |
| jnengland77 | The formatting looks really funny... I just copied it out of a word document. | 01:23 |
| xenozephyr2 | anyone mind pointing me to a quick cheetsheet for the wiki markup, if they have one? | 01:28 |
| *** heineckm has joined #tp | 01:37 | |
| *** heineckm has quit IRC | 01:38 | |
| jnengland77 | Well, night all. | 01:39 |
| *** jnengland77 has quit IRC | 01:48 | |
| llnz | xenozephyr2: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Cheatsheet | 02:02 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1cox> (at en.wikipedia.org) | 02:02 |
| xenozephyr2 | thanks | 02:03 |
| cherez | tansell: Ping? | 02:11 |
| *** tansell-laptop has joined #tp | 02:21 | |
| *** nash has quit IRC | 02:22 | |
| *** mithro has joined #tp | 02:37 | |
| *** alanp has quit IRC | 03:09 | |
| cherez | mithro: Ping? | 03:12 |
| mithro | cherez: | 03:12 |
| mithro | pong | 03:12 |
| mithro | just reading the applications now | 03:12 |
| mithro | I see yours is in | 03:12 |
| cherez | Alright, that's all I had to say then. | 03:12 |
| cherez | Criticism is welcome, of course. | 03:13 |
| xenozephyr2 | http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/GSoC_2009-xenozephyr | 03:30 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/35IZ> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 03:30 |
| xenozephyr2 | just finished a rough draft.. | 03:30 |
| xenozephyr2 | already found a bunch of things I want to iron out more, lol..but its late so ima do that tomorrow. feedback is welcome =] | 03:31 |
| mithro | cherez: comment posted | 03:33 |
| mithro | can everyone with a proposal in the wiki move it under the following topic | 03:34 |
| mithro | http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Proposals2009 | 03:34 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/35Ig> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 03:35 |
| cherez | mithro: Thanks, I'll have another draft tomorrow. | 03:35 |
| adrian_mo16 | llnz: ping ? | 03:39 |
| llnz | adrian_mo16: pong | 03:40 |
| adrian_mo16 | llnz: im looking at the library used for symbol importing (used in tpserver-cpp) and i was wondering if it would be feasable to add support for dll's in windows | 03:40 |
| adrian_mo16 | llnz: though i am currently looking for a method of manually importing symbols w/o using GetModuleAddress | 03:40 |
| llnz | libltdl? it should already i think | 03:41 |
| llnz | maybe it doesn't though | 03:41 |
| adrian_mo16 | i'm seeing that it only does static windows libs | 03:41 |
| adrian_mo16 | or that's what i understood from the docs | 03:41 |
| adrian_mo16 | quote from tpserver-cpp/pluginmanager.cpp "Running on windows, only statically linked modules will be avaliable" | 03:42 |
| adrian_mo16 | in PluginManager::Start | 03:42 |
| llnz | you might want to check the actual libltdl docs | 03:44 |
| adrian_mo16 | hmm, you're right, it does appear to support Win16/32, i guess that part i found in pluginmanager.cpp is from an earlier version | 03:46 |
| llnz | probably | 03:47 |
| mithro | adrian_mo16: it's a limitation of windows | 03:53 |
| mithro | all dll's can only depend on other dll's | 03:53 |
| mithro | so for it to work | 03:54 |
| mithro | most of tpserver's core would need to become a library | 03:54 |
| mithro | which the ruleset and other dlls could then depend on | 03:54 |
| adrian_mo16 | i know that, but yes, it gets way more complex | 03:54 |
| mithro | under unix | 03:54 |
| mithro | all symbols just have to be resolved at start time | 03:55 |
| adrian_mo16 | i've read the tl_dlinit and tl_dlsym | 03:55 |
| mithro | that is why we only support static linking on windows | 03:56 |
| adrian_mo16 | understood | 03:56 |
| mithro | someone could fix it | 03:58 |
| mithro | but nobody felt it was worth doing | 03:58 |
| mithro | because nobody really cares about windows | 03:58 |
| adrian_mo16 | i've looked a bit on google for the dll format, in order to do the same loading as it is currently done in lt_dlinit, but i can't find more than 1 or 2 results regarding this | 03:59 |
| adrian_mo16 | i'm guessing MS keeps it pretty secret | 03:59 |
| adrian_mo16 | the other method would have been with .def's to declare exports, but that further complexifies the idea | 04:00 |
| adrian_mo16 | (sorry if `complexifies` is not a word, i'm not a native English speaker :) | 04:00 |
| adrian_mo16 | llnz: i have updated my proposal, adding the requested modifications | 04:11 |
| adrian_mo16 | (on gsoc site: "Further improvements to the server for TP written in C++ with the addition of support for BattleXML") | 04:12 |
| llnz | adrian_mo16: cool | 04:12 |
| llnz | i'll have a look soon | 04:12 |
| adrian_mo16 | ok, i've to go to the university, see you later | 04:12 |
| *** adrian_mo16 has quit IRC | 04:13 | |
| JLP | good morning everyone | 04:20 |
| mithro | hey JLP | 04:24 |
| mithro | how goes things? | 04:24 |
| JLP | a bit depressing weather for the last few days, but otherwise ok | 04:28 |
| llnz | hi JLP | 04:29 |
| mithro | Landon: ping? | 04:45 |
| *** BarryCarlyon has quit IRC | 05:42 | |
| *** llnz2 has joined #tp | 05:45 | |
| *** llnz has quit IRC | 05:45 | |
| *** llnz2 is now known as llnz | 05:45 | |
| *** tansell-laptop has quit IRC | 06:09 | |
| *** bcarlyon|laptop has joined #tp | 06:22 | |
| * llnz wanders off | 06:25 | |
| llnz | later all | 06:25 |
| *** llnz has quit IRC | 06:25 | |
| *** q00u has joined #TP | 06:48 | |
| *** Patrick` has quit IRC | 06:50 | |
| *** Patrick` has joined #tp | 06:50 | |
| *** gau_veldt has quit IRC | 07:08 | |
| *** gau_veldt has joined #tp | 07:08 | |
| *** Black-Panther has joined #tp | 07:51 | |
| *** skiffcz has joined #tp | 07:56 | |
| *** tansell-laptop has joined #tp | 08:03 | |
| *** didi has joined #tp | 08:12 | |
| skiffcz | mithro: ping? | 08:29 |
| mithro | skiffcz: pong | 08:29 |
| *** bddebian has joined #tp | 08:30 | |
| skiffcz | hi, I was thinking about that python/cpp thing .. and in fact, richt now Im more confused about it than at the start | 08:30 |
| skiffcz | for cpp, there are few main pros: | 08:30 |
| BCarlyon|Server | I added my timeline proposal to my, er, proposal, http://thousandparsec.net/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/BarryCarlyon_proposal | 08:30 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/34I_> (at thousandparsec.net) | 08:30 |
| *** Black-Panther has quit IRC | 08:30 | |
| skiffcz | 1, I know it | 08:30 |
| skiffcz | 2, I have a lib to build my project already | 08:31 |
| skiffcz | cons: | 08:31 |
| skiffcz | 1, you say the libproto-py is much more further .. | 08:31 |
| skiffcz | but here is the question - how much? is it really that bad? i was looking a bit around and it seems to be able to get universe, send order frames ... what more would i possibly need? | 08:32 |
| skiffcz | but I dont know .. so Im asking | 08:32 |
| bddebian | Heya | 08:34 |
| skiffcz | On the other hand, I dont have that much work to lose .. and its tempting to learn new language... eh .. and of course, if the python development is priority for TP, then it would make sense not to split effort ... | 08:34 |
| mithro | BCarlyon|Server: btw - have you submitted it to the GSoC app? | 08:34 |
| *** didi has quit IRC | 08:34 | |
| *** q00u has left #TP | 08:34 | |
| skiffcz | Uhm .. I apologize for being so undecided, but I blame you for putting this worm in my head, so Id like you to help me kill it :) | 08:36 |
| Landon | mithro: bingback | 08:36 |
| mithro | Landon: you have comments | 08:36 |
| Landon | great! I'll get to them after class | 08:37 |
| mithro | skiffcz: I recommend putting your proposal in so others can comment on it too | 08:37 |
| BCarlyon|Server | mithro, not yet | 08:38 |
| mithro | the sooner the better | 08:38 |
| BCarlyon|Server | mithro, looking for feedback at the moment | 08:38 |
| Patrick` | putting it into the gsoc site isn't final | 08:38 |
| Patrick` | you can make changes to it | 08:38 |
| BCarlyon|Server | Really? | 08:38 |
| mithro | it's getting hard to track all the stuff in the wiki :) | 08:38 |
| BCarlyon|Server | I didnt know you could edit on melange | 08:38 |
| Patrick` | yeah, I've been editing mine there | 08:38 |
| BCarlyon|Server | Can mentors see then if you having hit finished? | 08:39 |
| Patrick` | I don't know. | 08:39 |
| Patrick` | I put it in, got comments, changed it | 08:39 |
| BCarlyon|Server | Ah | 08:39 |
| Patrick` | I think a lot of people might have the same misunderstanding | 08:39 |
| BCarlyon|Server | Ill submit it then | 08:39 |
| mithro | BCarlyon|Server: yes you can edit it | 08:40 |
| mithro | of course the wiki is nice | 08:40 |
| BCarlyon|Server | Submitted :-) | 08:43 |
| *** DarthEther has joined #tp | 08:50 | |
| DarthEther | hi all | 08:51 |
| DarthEther | I want to be in your developing team at GSoC | 08:51 |
| bddebian | mithro: Should the binary packages in tpserver-cpp really be tpserver-cpp-tpcl-guile, tpserver-cpp-tpcl-mzscheme, etc? | 08:52 |
| mithro | bddebian: as appose to? | 08:52 |
| mithro | DarthEther: it would be good to submit a proposal then :) | 08:52 |
| ezod | morning | 08:53 |
| bddebian | Dunno, just making sure. It seems in the tpserver-cpp metapackage I had tpserver-cpp-scheme-guile, tpserver-cpp-scheme-mzscheme or some such?? Not sure where I ever got that | 08:54 |
| DarthEther | thousandparsec.net/wiki said another :) | 08:54 |
| DarthEther | "Proposer has contacted us prior to the submission" (c) | 08:54 |
| DarthEther | so should I write a proposal right niw? | 08:55 |
| DarthEther | *now | 08:55 |
| BCarlyon|Server | DarthEther, this counts as contact prior to submission | 08:55 |
| BCarlyon|Server | At least it does in my book | 08:55 |
| DarthEther | ok then :) | 08:56 |
| BCarlyon|Server | Im not a mentor btw | 08:56 |
| BCarlyon|Server | Which project are you looking at DarthEther? | 08:56 |
| DarthEther | you mean what idea? | 08:57 |
| BCarlyon|Server | yes | 08:57 |
| ezod | DarthEther: the idea is you can get familiar with the project and discuss your proposal with us here - likely to be much better than if you simply write one up and post it | 08:58 |
| ezod | but do post one soon ;) | 08:58 |
| DarthEther | this is funny, but while reading all docs, mentioned in organization description, I didn't read the ideas. yet | 08:58 |
| BCarlyon|Server | rofl | 08:58 |
| DarthEther | yep :) | 08:58 |
| DarthEther | I suppose I'll choose MTSec | 09:01 |
| DarthEther | that idea means the new game should be written, am I right? | 09:05 |
| DarthEther | oh yeah, I want to join to MTSec developing group :) | 09:06 |
| *** peres has joined #tp | 09:14 | |
| skiffcz | ah ... after half an hour of pain, I finally managed to submit it not looking like a bad joke ... I hope the formatting is all right now ;) | 09:15 |
| Patrick` | well | 09:20 |
| Patrick` | so far I've not gone on IRC at all instead of revision | 09:20 |
| Patrick` | .. oops | 09:20 |
| mithro | scheme/tpcl are both fine | 09:32 |
| DarthEther | ezod so who I should talk to? | 09:33 |
| mithro | skiffcz: feel free to submit a patch to melange to fix the formatting :) | 09:33 |
| skiffcz | mithro: :P Ok, Aprils fools, right? srly, its not that bad, but compared to the wiki style its .. worse :) | 09:36 |
| ezod | DarthEther: with regards to MTSec you mean? | 09:36 |
| DarthEther | yes | 09:36 |
| mithro | skiffcz: melange is open source | 09:37 |
| skiffcz | but yup, I got it | 09:37 |
| * skiffcz stops complaining about things that he couldnt do better in the first place ;) | 09:38 | |
| DarthEther | ezod yes. so to whom? | 09:40 |
| ezod | DarthEther: i think llnz is most involved with that | 09:43 |
| ezod | DarthEther: maybe mithro as well? | 09:43 |
| DarthEther | maybe :) | 09:44 |
| DarthEther | mithro what do you know about MTSec development? :) | 09:44 |
| epyon | llnz was the man to ask about tp-server-cpp? | 09:48 |
| ezod | epyon: yes | 09:48 |
| * epyon waits for llnz | 09:49 | |
| Patrick` | mithro: ping | 09:50 |
| Patrick` | or anyone else | 09:50 |
| Patrick` | supporting a built-in HTTP server is the one thing i'm not 100% on the origin | 09:50 |
| Patrick` | it's not something the cpp server already supports, is it? | 09:51 |
| Patrick` | it's just a "nice to have" | 09:51 |
| ezod | Patrick`: built in http server for what? | 09:52 |
| * DarthEther waits for llnz | 09:52 | |
| Patrick` | for downloading media, battle data | 09:52 |
| DarthEther | epyon could you call me when you cath him? | 09:52 |
| Patrick` | it was presented as part of the twisted port goals that I based my proposal off | 09:53 |
| Patrick` | but I was never 100% about it | 09:53 |
| ezod | Patrick`: btw, see my commnet on your app - re: remote admin | 09:53 |
| Patrick` | yeah | 09:53 |
| Patrick` | it was editing that item that got me thinking about the other one as well | 09:53 |
| BCarlyon|Server | i was pondering about that | 10:02 |
| BCarlyon|Server | That is sorta loosley part of my application. | 10:02 |
| BCarlyon|Server | The webclient can generate it, but I was thinking of caching data into a mysql database, to save load on the server. | 10:03 |
| BCarlyon|Server | Perhaps generating xml feeds for 3rd party apps to have something to play with | 10:03 |
| BCarlyon|Server | I'd better add that bit to my app..... | 10:03 |
| BCarlyon|Server | heh its already in my app | 10:03 |
| *** alanp has joined #tp | 10:28 | |
| *** krl83 has joined #tp | 10:49 | |
| Landon | mithro: I'm trying to run the pyogre client again | 11:01 |
| Landon | but there's an error with pulsecore it looks like | 11:01 |
| Landon | http://landon.pastebin.com/m34e3b7ad | 11:02 |
| tpb | Title: landon private pastebin - collaborative debugging tool (at landon.pastebin.com) | 11:02 |
| *** krl83 has quit IRC | 11:21 | |
| *** Black-Panther has joined #tp | 11:38 | |
| Black-Panther | hi! | 11:39 |
| Black-Panther | Some GSoC mentor in here? | 11:39 |
| ezod | Black-Panther: hi | 11:40 |
| Black-Panther | hi! | 11:40 |
| alanp | hello | 11:41 |
| Black-Panther | I submitted my proposal now... Could someone go over it? Or should I mail it to the mailinglist? | 11:41 |
| ezod | Black-Panther: which is yours? | 11:42 |
| Black-Panther | Julian | 11:42 |
| ezod | ah | 11:42 |
| Black-Panther | thanks | 11:42 |
| ezod | Black-Panther: i'll look at it more thoroughly soon, but from a first glance i think you should take a look a the TP protocol (if you haven't) and explain in detail how each part of your ruleset fits into it | 11:44 |
| Black-Panther | ok | 11:45 |
| Black-Panther | I'll | 11:45 |
| ezod | http://thousandparsec.net/tp/dev/documents/protocol3.php | 11:48 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/35OV> (at thousandparsec.net) | 11:48 |
| ezod | that's the current version (0.3) | 11:48 |
| ezod | http://thousandparsec.net/tp/dev/documents/protocolxml.php | 11:48 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/35OX> (at thousandparsec.net) | 11:48 |
| Black-Panther | started already to read it | 11:48 |
| ezod | ok | 11:48 |
| ezod | it should give you an idea what is currently possible | 11:49 |
| Black-Panther | ok, thx | 11:49 |
| *** alanp has quit IRC | 12:04 | |
| *** bcarlyon|laptop has quit IRC | 12:36 | |
| *** Azkar_ has joined #tp | 12:36 | |
| *** Erroneous has joined #tp | 12:41 | |
| *** Azkar_ has quit IRC | 12:42 | |
| Black-Panther | ezod: you said I should explain how each part of my ruleset fits into the protocol... how do you mean that? What object I create? | 12:42 |
| *** ezod has quit IRC | 12:50 | |
| *** peres has quit IRC | 12:55 | |
| *** Black-Panther has quit IRC | 12:57 | |
| *** fintan has joined #tp | 13:04 | |
| fintan | hi everyone | 13:04 |
| fintan | is anyone around? | 13:07 |
| JLP | fintan: ahoy, i'm here now | 13:16 |
| fintan | hi! just introducing myself, i'm looking at thousand parsec for summer of code! | 13:21 |
| fintan | but i must go now as i'm staying with my parents :( | 13:21 |
| fintan | will be back later hopefully | 13:22 |
| *** fintan has quit IRC | 13:22 | |
| *** ezod has joined #tp | 13:27 | |
| *** bcarlyon|laptop has joined #tp | 13:27 | |
| *** ruzette has joined #tp | 13:28 | |
| ruzette | Hi, may I ask a question? Does the project in mind needs to implement 4X? | 13:29 |
| ruzette | Thanks. | 13:29 |
| JLP | ruzette: hi | 13:30 |
| JLP | i'm not sure i understand your question | 13:31 |
| ruzette | What if I want to create an MMO on a console, can I submit my proposal on TP? | 13:32 |
| * ezod is lost | 13:34 | |
| JLP | well thousand parsec can be used for MMOs and if you are thinking about improving the console client to play TP games... | 13:34 |
| ruzette | ...? | 13:34 |
| *** ArchangelShrike has joined #tp | 13:35 | |
| JLP | ruzette: i think you will need to read more about what TP is | 13:35 |
| ruzette | I'm sorry, but I'm lost with TP's wiki. I couldn't find any info on what TP does exactly. | 13:37 |
| JLP | ruzette: well the home page gives a very high level description | 13:38 |
| ezod | ruzette: http://thousandparsec.net/tp/gettingstarted.php | 13:38 |
| tpb | Title: Thousand Parsec : Getting Started (at thousandparsec.net) | 13:38 |
| * skiffcz still waits for llnz to answer some of his questions, then will try to improve his proposal ;) | 13:42 | |
| Patrick` | a proposal to implement world of warcraft for the wii would be unlikely to succeed | 13:43 |
| ruzette | JLP: what if the project in mind is not related to any space empire but will help *somewhat* TP in writing for consoles? *methinks* .. can i still submit the proposal? | 13:44 |
| Patrick` | what do you mean by console? | 13:44 |
| Patrick` | the text interface to an operating system, or a games console | 13:44 |
| ruzette | gaming console | 13:45 |
| ezod | ruzette: are you talking about writing a TP client for a game console? | 13:45 |
| ezod | otherwise i really don't see how it would apply | 13:45 |
| Patrick` | console development is difficult in the context of open source | 13:46 |
| ruzette | what do you mean? | 13:46 |
| *** DarthEther has quit IRC | 13:46 | |
| Patrick` | well, the cost of development licenses and certification | 13:46 |
| JLP | ruzette: usally the game develoeprs have to pay game console makers to get their games on them | 13:46 |
| JLP | the only way to get your game on them is like with PlayStation 3 where you can install Linux on them and then run games on Linux | 13:47 |
| *** torghul has joined #tp | 13:47 | |
| ezod | well, there are homebrew scenes for every console, with varying degrees of success | 13:47 |
| Patrick` | and legality | 13:47 |
| ezod | right, that too | 13:47 |
| ruzette | but is it still possible? | 13:47 |
| ezod | ruzette: you haven't figured this part out? | 13:48 |
| ezod | i.e. what console are we talking about? | 13:48 |
| ruzette | a DS | 13:48 |
| ezod | what sdk or homebrew environment are you going to use to develop it? | 13:49 |
| Patrick` | and do you have experience developing homebrew for the DS? | 13:49 |
| Patrick` | sorry, I'll shut up | 13:49 |
| ruzette | yes but i have little experience | 13:49 |
| ruzette | there are libraries for Project Darkstar written in NDS | 13:50 |
| Patrick` | well, all it needs to do is support python :) | 13:50 |
| ruzette | Sorry, I don't understand much. :) | 13:52 |
| ezod | ruzette: the only TP project i can see on the DS would be a client implementation | 13:53 |
| ezod | and before your proposal could possibly be accepted we would need to see reasonable evidence that you can get it done | 13:53 |
| ezod | that includes having a pretty specific idea what existing DS tools/libraries you would use | 13:54 |
| cherez | mithro: Ping | 13:54 |
| ezod | and probably some way of porting one of the protocol libraries to it | 13:54 |
| ruzette | hmm | 13:56 |
| ezod | even building on an existing protocol and client library stack, writing a whole client is a tough project for 3 months | 13:56 |
| ezod | so what i mean is you need to make sure the rest of the stuff is out of the way | 13:57 |
| ruzette | Ok ok. :) | 13:58 |
| Patrick` | ruzette: so going back to your original question | 13:58 |
| Patrick` | yes, any proposal that would be accepted here would need to be about 4X games in the context of tp | 13:58 |
| Patrick` | I have a vested interest in reducing the number of applicants, though, so don't listen to me | 13:59 |
| ruzette | hehe. | 14:00 |
| JLP | Patrick`: well less applicant could mean less slots which is not so good for the project | 14:00 |
| ruzette | I'll come up with something. ;) Thanks for your time. :) | 14:02 |
| ezod | ruzette: great, and you are welcome | 14:02 |
| Patrick` | JLP: really? | 14:02 |
| ezod | ruzette: we'll be happy to answer any more questions | 14:02 |
| Patrick` | ok, so if I was corrupt and self-serving I would want to encourage applicants with rubbish proposals | 14:03 |
| ezod | Patrick`: not necessarily either - slot allocation is not a simple algorithm | 14:03 |
| Patrick` | ... I think I'd better lay off the caffiene | 14:03 |
| Patrick` | yeah, I did wonder academically about how it works | 14:03 |
| Patrick` | some kind of proposal ranking done by the org and then magically levelled by google | 14:04 |
| Patrick` | when I'm not involved in it any more I'll go ask the | 14:04 |
| ezod | note that that should not be read "a non-simple algorithm", but closer to "not just an algorithm" | 14:04 |
| Patrick` | ok, yeah, I meant there's people involved the whole way | 14:04 |
| ezod | right | 14:04 |
| CIA-1 | mithro web * r263e0fca02d9 /downloads/downloads.xml: Update the xml file for 0.3.2 release. | 14:05 |
| CIA-1 | mithro web * rc5f696301778 /news/2009-03-31-2300.news: Added the singleplayer announcement. | 14:05 |
| CIA-1 | mithro web * r3a30cbf40cbe /downloads/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Merge branch 'master' of git+ssh://[email protected]/git/web | 14:05 |
| * ezod cheer | 14:05 | |
| ezod | i hope people don't think the 0.3.2 release is an april fool's joke | 14:11 |
| ezod | it *has* been a long time coming | 14:12 |
| JLP | ezod: the australian guy released it, it's april 2nd there, so no worries :) | 14:12 |
| ezod | JLP: timezones to the rescue! | 14:13 |
| ezod | never thought i'd say that in #tp | 14:13 |
| JLP | hehe yeah | 14:13 |
| ArchangelShrike | please correct me if i'm wrong: currently there's no way in the clients to be able to send messages to other players, right? | 14:18 |
| ezod | ArchangelShrike: no, i don't think any of the clients support that | 14:20 |
| ArchangelShrike | ok | 14:20 |
| Patrick` | "psst, let's "attack" each other. We'll direct death fleets at each others home planets, but at the halfway passing point, we're only 20 light years's from barney's territory. then we make a right angle | 14:23 |
| Patrick` | aaaand that's why in-game email is awesome :D | 14:23 |
| ArchangelShrike | it seems that implementing Diplomacy before the messageboard system is developed would be a no go then | 14:31 |
| ArchangelShrike | silly me | 14:31 |
| ezod | ArchangelShrike: add it to your proposal :) | 14:32 |
| Patrick` | meh, you can do out of band communication no problem | 14:32 |
| Patrick` | or that | 14:32 |
| Patrick` | yeah, it'd be cool to see | 14:32 |
| tpb | New news from http://www.thousandparsec.net/tp/rss.php: Single Player released! - A tale of Google Summer of Code | 14:32 |
| ArchangelShrike | out of band is easy enough, but it'd be easier to keep track of who you're messaging in game, maybe | 14:32 |
| ArchangelShrike | or message everyone in the game at once | 14:33 |
| ArchangelShrike | unless you threw everyone in a irc channel and msged everyone privately to do backroom deals | 14:33 |
| ezod | mithro: ping? | 14:34 |
| epyon | general ping | 14:52 |
| ezod | epyon: pong! | 14:56 |
| ezod | mithro: if you read this, we need a source tarball for tpclient-pywx before i can do the gentoo ebuild | 14:58 |
| *** llnz has joined #tp | 14:59 | |
| epyon | llnz! | 15:00 |
| llnz | hi | 15:00 |
| epyon | llnz: as even nash seems to be doubtful of my primary proposal, I was thinking about doing a secondary proposal directed at the C++ server, afair you are the man to ask about it... | 15:01 |
| llnz | yes | 15:02 |
| epyon | first of all, are there any immidate needs in the C++ server? Anything you can think of? | 15:02 |
| llnz | nothing ciritical or high priority | 15:03 |
| epyon | I had two ideas while browsing the source code though | 15:04 |
| epyon | 1) you use boost::signals, why don't go the whole boost way then? There are many libraries in boost that would cut on code much, ensuring quality and foremost stability, while making the code more readable | 15:05 |
| epyon | not to mention reducing dependencies | 15:05 |
| llnz | reducing dependencies? how? | 15:06 |
| *** Azkar_ has joined #tp | 15:07 | |
| epyon | 2) as far as I see the connection handling is not based on any design pattern, did you think about rewriting it to for example the proactor pattern? I did that at work with our server, and suddenly the code became absurdly readable | 15:07 |
| epyon | by having boost handle the dependencies. GnuTLS is one example | 15:07 |
| epyon | and the copy-pasted mersenne twister is an example of code reusage :) | 15:08 |
| epyon | also by rewriting it to boost::asio you'd increase stability and readability IMHO | 15:08 |
| llnz | the reason there isn't more boost is that I haven't read about the other bit yet | 15:09 |
| llnz | i know about boost.random (hence it's in the short tasks list) | 15:09 |
| epyon | Anyway, my question is whether you see a proposal in what I wrote | 15:09 |
| epyon | I'd be really happy to work on server refactoring, suplying it by the way with proper doxymentation and UML documentation. | 15:10 |
| * ezod likes it, fwiw :) | 15:11 | |
| epyon | :D | 15:11 |
| ezod | there's a fair bit of code duplication between admin and player stuff that can be refactored | 15:12 |
| epyon | would be my pleasure :P | 15:13 |
| *** alanp has joined #tp | 15:15 | |
| llnz | epyon: there could well be a project in that | 15:15 |
| bcarlyon|laptop | hey llnz I added timeline and thre my app in the office applications list | 15:16 |
| llnz | bcarlyon|laptop: cool, will look at it soon | 15:17 |
| epyon | llnz: ok, I'll see what I can cook up | 15:17 |
| *** alanp has quit IRC | 15:17 | |
| llnz | epyon: btw, the server is currently single threaded and using a reactor pattern | 15:17 |
| *** xenozephyr has joined #tp | 15:19 | |
| llnz | mainly because nothing is thread safe (especially the persistence layer and the various managers) | 15:19 |
| epyon | the reactor is barely visible :/ | 15:19 |
| epyon | that could be fixed | 15:19 |
| llnz | Network is the core of it | 15:19 |
| llnz | in fact... | 15:20 |
| epyon | however, I'd still say that it doesn't have to be too multithreaded | 15:20 |
| epyon | a simple fixed amount of threads would work | 15:20 |
| llnz | the proactive pattern is fairly similar to my asynchronous persistence and managers task | 15:20 |
| epyon | ...just so it takes advantage of multi-core machines. | 15:21 |
| epyon | however the server isn't that event driven, is it? | 15:22 |
| llnz | epyon: at the base, it has a select loop | 15:23 |
| llnz | and does non-blocking IO | 15:23 |
| epyon | this is where boost::asio would be brilliant | 15:23 |
| llnz | quite possibly | 15:23 |
| epyon | especially if you want more than a single thread | 15:23 |
| * llnz has been reading up on proactor pattern | 15:24 | |
| epyon | ( boost::thread hint, hint ^_^ ) | 15:24 |
| llnz | the carvaet in the ideas for programmers list still applys | 15:24 |
| epyon | I guess the first part of a refactor project if we'd like to do it as painlessly as possible would be to simplify and rewrite the internals as much as possible without touching the API | 15:27 |
| llnz | yeah | 15:27 |
| epyon | having further changes in mind | 15:27 |
| llnz | the core of tpserver-cpp has evolved over near 6 years | 15:27 |
| epyon | internally moving to boost::asio and preparing for boost::thread | 15:27 |
| llnz | particularly the socket stuff | 15:28 |
| llnz | it could well do with being tidyed up | 15:28 |
| epyon | Also what I'd like to see is moving to some more safe memory management mechanism ( like shared pointers ) | 15:28 |
| epyon | all of this would have to be done on a branch probably | 15:29 |
| epyon | unless we stick to the rule not to commit any changes that remove/break functionality even temporarily | 15:29 |
| *** ruzette has quit IRC | 15:30 | |
| llnz | typcially each student gets their own branch for gsoc | 15:30 |
| *** xenozephyr2 has quit IRC | 15:35 | |
| xenozephyr | llnz: I updated my proposal. (http://www.thousandparsec.net/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Proposals2009/xenozephyr). If you dont mind checking over it again, Im open to discuss it further as well. | 15:38 |
| tpb | <http://ln-s.net/35T+> (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 15:38 |
| llnz | xenozephyr: i will take a look | 15:38 |
| xenozephyr | if the group really feels strongly against flash I can consider changing the front end technology.. just its going to be a lot more work for me and im not exactly a web "designer", I don't make things pretty =P | 15:40 |
| epyon | xenozephyr: "The use of Flash/Flex can allow artistic individuals to implement a 2D game client on the frontend's existing code." <-- does that mean that the client will be just a library? | 15:42 |
| xenozephyr | no it'll have a frontend, very GUI like (like the python one), but it can be further styled to look much more like a game | 15:43 |
| xenozephyr | also if they want to turn it into a 2D game with animations and such it can be done | 15:43 |
| epyon | as far as simple graphics go I can supply them | 15:43 |
| xenozephyr | im just aiming for displaying information and inputting information | 15:44 |
| *** alanp has joined #tp | 15:44 | |
| llnz | xenozephyr: cool, you addressed most of my concerns | 15:44 |
| xenozephyr | I'll add more detail about the frontend extension | 15:44 |
| llnz | xenozephyr: the main reason i don't like flash is the it's not an open standard, and I don't have it working under linux | 15:45 |
| Landon | is anyone around that can help me try and get the pyogre client working? | 15:45 |
| llnz | but you could use flash | 15:45 |
| *** ArchangelShrike has quit IRC | 15:46 | |
| *** alanp has quit IRC | 15:53 | |
| *** didi has joined #tp | 15:54 | |
| * llnz starts skimming the boost.asio docs when waiting for work | 16:05 | |
| *** Greg___ has joined #tp | 16:08 | |
| llnz | epyon: boost.asio looks a lot like what I have done in libtpproto-cpp | 16:15 |
| llnz | which is where i had hoped tpserver-cpp might have headed toward as well | 16:15 |
| llnz | (except that libtpproto-cpp has to integrate with different event loops) | 16:17 |
| epyon | Personally I think it's always better to use existing (well tested) libraries than reinvent the wheel. Especially if a dependency is already there :) | 17:00 |
| epyon | So that would be one of the aims of the proposal | 17:01 |
| *** alanp has joined #tp | 17:11 | |
| alanp | hello | 17:14 |
| *** fusionlove has joined #tp | 17:14 | |
| *** nebajoth has joined #tp | 17:17 | |
| nebajoth | I propose a name-change for this project, to "Over 9000 Parsecs" | 17:18 |
| nebajoth | actually | 17:18 |
| nebajoth | lets also change the spelling of Parsecs to "Parsex" while we're at it | 17:18 |
| nebajoth | really give it that extra oomph | 17:18 |
| nebajoth | so, the end result, I guess, would be "Over 9000 Parsex" | 17:18 |
| nebajoth | just rolls off the tongue, yah? | 17:18 |
| fusionlove | as long as no one mentions the millennium falcon | 17:19 |
| fusionlove | hello everyone, i'm a summer of code possible! :) | 17:19 |
| fusionlove | have you been seeing a lot of the likes of me? | 17:20 |
| alanp | hello | 17:20 |
| ezod | fusionlove: natch | 17:20 |
| fusionlove | i would have thought tp would be really popular!! | 17:20 |
| nebajoth | :D | 17:21 |
| fusionlove | students: OH WOWES A SPACE GAME | 17:21 |
| ezod | fusionlove: naturally | 17:21 |
| nebajoth | there's been over 9000 applicants | 17:21 |
| nebajoth | and btw | 17:21 |
| fusionlove | lol | 17:21 |
| nebajoth | OH WOWES A SPACE GAME | 17:21 |
| fusionlove | >> | 17:21 |
| fusionlove | << | 17:21 |
| fusionlove | soo | 17:22 |
| fusionlove | have any of you guys done some developing? | 17:22 |
| alanp | many of the people in this chanel have | 17:23 |
| Patrick` | the developers have | 17:23 |
| nebajoth | you mean on TP specifically? | 17:23 |
| nebajoth | errrr | 17:23 |
| nebajoth | O9TP | 17:23 |
| fusionlove | uyes, on tp :D | 17:23 |
| fusionlove | i haven't been able to build anything yet | 17:24 |
| fusionlove | because I am stuck on my parents' ancient mac in the french countryside | 17:25 |
| nebajoth | you poor person | 17:25 |
| fusionlove | normally I have an Actual Laptop and an Actual Broadband connection | 17:26 |
| *** torghul has quit IRC | 17:26 | |
| fusionlove | but i stupidly decided to go home bang in the middle of applications | 17:26 |
| ezod | fusionlove: any idea what you'd be interested in working on? | 17:26 |
| fusionlove | well | 17:26 |
| fusionlove | i used to love an ancient mac game called escape velocity | 17:26 |
| fusionlove | and i've been thinking about implementing a ruleset based on that | 17:27 |
| fusionlove | it'd be exciting as it's based on flying around trading, fighting etc rather than sitting back and controlling a whole empire | 17:27 |
| epyon | fusionlove: take a look at EliteSec ;) | 17:28 |
| ezod | fusionlove: very similar to epyon's proposal | 17:28 |
| ezod | eyah | 17:28 |
| * ezod back later | 17:29 | |
| fusionlove | Ahh, elite! | 17:29 |
| fusionlove | elite =~= escape velocity | 17:30 |
| * epyon wonders what fusionlove meant by =~=... | 17:30 | |
| epyon | Depending on which math symbol that it is simillar to it is, it could mean one thing or quite the opposite :P | 17:31 |
| fusionlove | the curvy, nearly-equals symbol :) | 17:31 |
| nebajoth | my wife has one of those | 17:31 |
| fusionlove | i got the chance to play elite on a proper bbc micro once :) | 17:32 |
| fusionlove | it's much harder than it looks! | 17:32 |
| fusionlove | do you think a proposal that's so similar to yours would be discouraged? | 17:34 |
| fusionlove | epyon: i wouldn't want to steal your idea | 17:35 |
| epyon | I dunno, I have nothing against :) | 17:36 |
| epyon | I tried to push EliteSec also last year | 17:36 |
| *** JLP has quit IRC | 17:38 | |
| *** JLP has joined #tp | 17:38 | |
| *** kjdf has joined #tp | 17:45 | |
| fusionlove | is anyone else applying for GSoC? | 17:50 |
| *** peres has joined #tp | 17:51 | |
| cherez | Yep. | 17:51 |
| fusionlove | what's your idea about? | 17:52 |
| cherez | libtpproto2-py | 17:52 |
| fusionlove | aha :D | 17:55 |
| fusionlove | mine is more scenario-based | 17:56 |
| *** JLafont has joined #tp | 17:56 | |
| nebajoth | I may apply too | 17:57 |
| nebajoth | perhaps more than 9000 times | 17:57 |
| nebajoth | in order to guarantee approval | 17:57 |
| fusionlove | do it :D | 17:58 |
| fusionlove | write some sort of bot to get conficker to do your applications | 17:58 |
| fusionlove | then crash google | 17:58 |
| fusionlove | and the WORLD will be YOURS | 17:58 |
| didi | Is there some sort of log of a game? | 17:59 |
| nebajoth | the WORLD | 18:03 |
| nebajoth | will be MINE | 18:03 |
| didi | Anyone? | 18:03 |
| fusionlove | i think not... | 18:03 |
| fusionlove | but I'm kind of a beginner to tp so there yet may be! | 18:04 |
| fusionlove | maybe that would be a good gsoc project | 18:04 |
| didi | fusionlove: Maybe yes. :-) But looking at the project list I see a project called "battleviewer". The description say that it is a data visualizer. So, someone needs to feed it with data. | 18:06 |
| *** xenozephyr1 has joined #tp | 18:08 | |
| fusionlove | *reads about battleviewer* | 18:11 |
| Vadtec | afternoon all | 18:12 |
| didi | Vadtec: Bye. | 18:13 |
| Vadtec | ? | 18:13 |
| Vadtec | i assume you are leaving? | 18:13 |
| *** xenozephyr has quit IRC | 18:14 | |
| fusionlove | didi: sorry I can't help! | 18:16 |
| didi | fusionlove: That's ok. | 18:16 |
| fusionlove | has anyone any experience with the parsek client? | 18:16 |
| didi | Vadtec: Sorry. I though that you were leaving. | 18:16 |
| fusionlove | here it be quarter past midnight ;) afternoon! | 18:17 |
| Vadtec | didi: oh lol, no, this is normally when i become active | 18:18 |
| fusionlove | no parsek then...? | 18:23 |
| JLP | fusionlove: hi, i'm the one who started working on it | 18:24 |
| JLP | fusionlove: and soory for the delay | 18:24 |
| didi | Sorry to ask again, but is there some sort of log mechanism of a game? | 18:26 |
| JLP | didi: as in the server logging the history? | 18:26 |
| fusionlove | hi! it's ok | 18:27 |
| fusionlove | do you know whether anyone's proposed continuing work this year? | 18:27 |
| fusionlove | i've had a look at the docs and I'd be quite interested | 18:27 |
| JLP | fusionlove: yeah, we got 2 applications so far | 18:27 |
| fusionlove | I've looked into kde + qt before | 18:27 |
| didi | JLP: It could be. At the player's side would be better. Like: player 3 moved battleship to plane earth. That sort of thing. | 18:28 |
| fusionlove | some kind of xml -> plain english log generator would be useful... | 18:29 |
| JLP | didi: for client side the server can generate a BattleXML with the description fo the battles, but nothing more | 18:29 |
| fusionlove | although I wonder how much demand there would be for actually reading plain english logs | 18:29 |
| didi | fusionlove: Actually I like play english much more than XMLs. Even for tasks that normally people think it should be XML. | 18:30 |
| JLP | didi: if you look at the battleviewer tree in git there is a desctiption of the format | 18:30 |
| didi | play = plain | 18:30 |
| *** xenozephyr has joined #tp | 18:35 | |
| fusionlove | could I ask what the applications / avaliable places ratio is like so far? | 18:42 |
| fusionlove | just generally... | 18:42 |
| JLP | fusionlove: we can't know until april 3rd when all the orgs collect applications | 18:43 |
| Patrick` | judging by the people that have applications in the wiki but not on the GSOC system, there's another 6 or 7 there | 18:43 |
| bcarlyon|laptop | Mines in woot! | 18:43 |
| Patrick` | and we've had a reminder from the gsoc project coordinator that we shouldn't consider this a final submission, having it there earlier is good | 18:43 |
| bcarlyon|laptop | I think they are trying to avoid having to extend the deadline | 18:44 |
| bcarlyon|laptop | I think people forget that you can edit an app onces its in the system | 18:44 |
| fusionlove | yes, it's better to apply earlier... | 18:49 |
| *** Azkar_ has quit IRC | 18:49 | |
| didi | Someone knows when nash normally (or if even) shows up? | 18:49 |
| fusionlove | no, sorry | 18:50 |
| llnz | didi: he should be around soon | 18:52 |
| didi | llnz: Nice. Thanks. | 18:52 |
| *** xenozephyr1 has quit IRC | 18:53 | |
| *** krl83 has joined #tp | 18:54 | |
| *** xenozephyr has quit IRC | 18:55 | |
| *** xenozephyr has joined #tp | 18:55 | |
| epyon | didi: <comment topic="As for me">... i even </talk> in <language>XML</language>. </comment> | 18:56 |
| didi | epyon: Lol. And it is actually a lot more cumbersome than plain english. | 18:56 |
| *** nash has joined #tp | 19:01 | |
| JLP | didi: ^ | 19:02 |
| didi | JLP: Nice. | 19:02 |
| didi | nash: Hi nash. | 19:02 |
| nash | heyo didi | 19:02 |
| didi | nash: I could not compile "galaxie". It seems that the E17 subversion's version is somewhat broken as I can make the "galaxie" found a function located inside the ewl library. So, I turn my attention to the code part and the proposal writing. Could you have a look at it later? | 19:04 |
| nash | yep | 19:05 |
| nash | didi: I'll just disable the ewl stuff. | 19:05 |
| nash | It needs to be replaced with elementary or something anyway | 19:05 |
| didi | Should I send it to you or commit it in the GSoC database? | 19:06 |
| nash | GSoc | 19:08 |
| nash | that way everyone can comment | 19:08 |
| nash | Also I saw something on the mentors mailing list that the earlier they are in the more slots we are likely to get or something | 19:09 |
| nash | bs | 19:09 |
| bcarlyon|laptop | rofl | 19:12 |
| didi | nash: Ok. I will just wrap it up and send it. | 19:12 |
| nash | didi: I'll try and get something to compile for you today | 19:17 |
| didi | nash: Thanks. | 19:17 |
| nash | tansell, tansell-laptop: Dude... I need to update my key on git.tp... | 19:19 |
| * nash also notes someone needs to get a cron job to run git gc && git repack on the server occasionally | 19:21 | |
| *** xenozephyr1 has joined #tp | 19:23 | |
| epyon | nash, I can't read from your comments if you don't like/believe in the EliteSec proposal, or just want it fleshed out more... | 19:24 |
| epyon | I don't have POST capabilities here, so I can't update my proposal on the wiki, but the problem you described can be solved quite easily without almost any changes to the design | 19:25 |
| llnz | nash: i could update it tonight, might also look at running those git commands | 19:26 |
| nash | epyon: To be frank, I _love_ the idea, just I'm not convinced it will work as a game | 19:26 |
| nash | llnz: Cool, thanks | 19:26 |
| nash | epyon: Especially things like combat worry me as presented | 19:27 |
| epyon | You love elite that's for sure :). And that's why I'd like you to help me to turn it into a playable game | 19:30 |
| nash | epyon: I don't want to think about how much time I've spent playing it ;-) | 19:31 |
| epyon | heh, same here ^^ | 19:31 |
| nash | epyon: If you can redo your basic combat design, or tweak it... and I think make jumps a one turn thing | 19:32 |
| nash | didi: galaxie build with my version of e17 ;-) | 19:32 |
| nash | yay | 19:32 |
| didi | nash: Nice! Did you changed something or it just did it? | 19:33 |
| nash | didi: No... just an old version of e17 ;-) | 19:33 |
| didi | nash: :-( | 19:34 |
| nash | didi: even my easy_e17 script is out of date | 19:34 |
| skiffcz | llnz: hello, do you have a sec? | 19:35 |
| didi | nash: Well. Under the circumstance I would maintain it as it is. ;-) | 19:36 |
| epyon | skiffcz: minisec or MTSec? | 19:36 |
| nash | didi: Nah, get it up to date | 19:36 |
| skiffcz | llnz: what exactly was meant by "missing features" in your comment to my proposal :) | 19:36 |
| didi | nash: Mine you say? | 19:36 |
| *** Greg___ has quit IRC | 19:36 | |
| nash | didi: No, mine | 19:37 |
| skiffcz | epyon: haha, good one :D well, both, ill start with minisec and mtsec will be my endgame goal .. :) | 19:37 |
| didi | nash: Noooo. It will broke ewl. | 19:37 |
| nash | didi: My next task for galaxie was to drop ewl/etk and find a replacement | 19:38 |
| nash | Fortunately it has happened in the time galaxie has been idle | 19:38 |
| didi | nash: What ewl is suppose to do? | 19:41 |
| nash | It's a widget toolkit | 19:41 |
| nash | It has a wacky property of _not_ working will with evas | 19:41 |
| nash | Which is really annoying | 19:42 |
| *** xenozephyr has quit IRC | 19:42 | |
| nash | I can write pure evas apps in my sleep (I often do... especially after a late night) | 19:42 |
| nash | But ewl has it's own model, which doesn't intergrate well | 19:42 |
| nash | Elementary is better ;-) | 19:42 |
| nash | So I'm goin gto move to that | 19:43 |
| * nash gets a new e17 checkout | 19:43 | |
| nash | didi: When does soc start proper? | 19:44 |
| * nash works best with a deadline ;-) | 19:44 | |
| didi | nash: Do you mean, when we need to start writing code? | 19:45 |
| nash | yeah | 19:45 |
| didi | nash: Well, the google page say that the results will be out at April 20. | 19:45 |
| nash | excellent | 19:46 |
| didi | nash: :-) | 19:46 |
| nash | didi: Well start looking anyway ;-) | 19:46 |
| nash | didi: I'll get somethign that compiles in the next day or so | 19:46 |
| llnz | skiffcz: just a moment | 19:48 |
| didi | nash: Sure. | 19:48 |
| nash | didi: If you are lucky may even be today | 19:48 |
| nash | Although I need to reactive my commit access for you to get it | 19:48 |
| didi | nash: :-) | 19:49 |
| didi | nash: Really hopping so. | 19:49 |
| nash | didi: /msg me your email address, and I can mail you a patch if you prefer | 19:49 |
| llnz | skiffcz: ahh, missing features in libtpproto-cpp, such as objectparameters and orders | 19:50 |
| didi | nash: Which way you prefer. I will send you my e-mail anyway. | 19:50 |
| llnz | and tp03 support | 19:50 |
| nash | Cool | 19:50 |
| nash | didi: it will depend on the time | 19:50 |
| skiffcz | llnz: yeah ..we sort of talked about it with mithro .. that python would bbe probably a better idea ... | 19:54 |
| llnz | skiffcz: well... i am working on adding them soon | 19:55 |
| *** peres has left #tp | 19:55 | |
| llnz | mithros suggestion about using python is from a development speed angle (faster to program, maybe easier to understand, easier to script) | 19:55 |
| epyon | llnz: do you keep logs from irc? | 19:56 |
| llnz | i don't (consiously, my irc client appears to) | 19:57 |
| llnz | but there are online logs of this channel | 19:57 |
| llnz | see the topic | 19:57 |
| epyon | aaah :D | 19:57 |
| epyon | that's good, because I lost our refactoring discussion and I'll need it for my proposal | 19:57 |
| llnz | http://www.thousandparsec.net/~irc/ | 19:58 |
| tpb | Title: Thousand Parsec : IRC logs (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 19:58 |
| skiffcz | llnz: ive never written anything in python, on the other hand, i have some idea how to do it in cpp, also have some code already.. python does not seem that hard to learn, its just that .. i dont know, cpp still seem to me somehow more appealing .. its a attitude thing i guess and its totally subjective, plus i dont know pythons capabilities, so its also lack of experience .. i dont want to get all "i like strong typed languages more" and this direction, | 20:00 |
| epyon | thanks :) | 20:00 |
| llnz | skiffcz: i use both c++ and python | 20:00 |
| llnz | mostly c++ for exsisting things and python for new things | 20:00 |
| *** Greywhind has quit IRC | 20:01 | |
| skiffcz | i just really dont know the future of libproto-cpp .. and mithro seems to be quite skeptical about it .. i wouldnt be happy to build my project on dead prerequisite, thats all | 20:01 |
| *** Greywhind has joined #tp | 20:01 | |
| llnz | libtpproto-cpp is used by: tpclient-cpptext, parsek, tpadmin-cpp | 20:03 |
| llnz | it is under active development | 20:03 |
| llnz | i hope it gets used for any c++ client development | 20:04 |
| skiffcz | llnz: heh, well, ive heard the very same advocation /against/ cpp protocol from mithro .. and that quite raised my confusion .. it was "hey, but libproto-py is used by 3 clients and id like to see llnz to work on server instead of proto-cpp" and suddenly i dont know "D | 20:06 |
| skiffcz | :D | 20:06 |
| skiffcz | but if its like that, ill try to find all reasons to use cpp and sum them up and stick to my original idea | 20:06 |
| llnz | skiffcz: also, ezod has some exprience with the library, and (given enough time) could continue to develop it | 20:08 |
| didi | nash: I just sent my proposal. Could you take a look later? | 20:08 |
| skiffcz | i was (and still am) ready to overcome any problems when facing less features in libproto-cpp, and its (imho) one of the benefits it can bring to TP - libproto-cpp gets used more and pushed forward hopefully (even though mithro does not seem to see it this way and would be probably happier if the effort was concentrated into libproto-py and/or tpserver-cpp) | 20:09 |
| nash | cool | 20:10 |
| nash | i shall | 20:10 |
| *** mithro has quit IRC | 20:12 | |
| skiffcz | so ok then .. ill stick to the original cpp proposal (btw its submited in google system now), make the timeline more speific, and try to gather as much reasoning for cpp as the language of choice plus investigate the possible solutions (in timeline) for libproto-cpp not being that much friendly as libproto-py | 20:16 |
| skiffcz | good night now .. and thanks for clarifying things a bit for me ;) | 20:18 |
| tansell | nash, llnz can help with the key thing too | 20:24 |
| nash | tansell: yep | 20:29 |
| *** mithro has joined #tp | 20:35 | |
| *** fusionlove has left #tp | 20:37 | |
| *** bcarlyon|laptop has quit IRC | 20:37 | |
| Patrick` | mithro: it's practically the definition of irony | 20:43 |
| Patrick` | I'm porting my old project to twisted to get a feel for it | 20:43 |
| Patrick` | but development is slow ... because I didn't have any high-level unit tests :) | 20:43 |
| llnz | Patrick`: hehe, makes you value them more doesn't it | 20:44 |
| Patrick` | yeah | 20:45 |
| Patrick` | since twisted has much better irc client support than server support | 20:45 |
| Patrick` | I would most probably have written it as a python bot anyway! | 20:45 |
| Patrick` | I fell back into the old routine of manually hammering off irssi to get it to work | 20:45 |
| Patrick` | whilst rocking back and forth and going aaagh this is retarded | 20:46 |
| Patrick` | if I actually made tests for this I could most probably fire them upstream | 20:47 |
| *** bcarlyon|laptop has joined #tp | 20:52 | |
| Landon | hey tansell , I've been trying to get the client running, and it seems I've got some new problems :\ | 20:59 |
| Landon | http://landon.pastebin.com/m463928e in specific | 21:01 |
| tpb | Title: landon private pastebin - collaborative debugging tool (at landon.pastebin.com) | 21:01 |
| Landon | the only thing I see that could be a problem is ogreal, which you've said I don't need | 21:01 |
| Landon | (fresh git pull btw) | 21:02 |
| *** kjdf has quit IRC | 21:02 | |
| Landon | looks like it's not reading a config file maybe | 21:04 |
| tansell | hrm | 21:05 |
| tansell | Landon, not quite sure | 21:05 |
| tansell | Landon, it doesn't crash? | 21:05 |
| tansell | just not start up? | 21:05 |
| Landon | exactly | 21:05 |
| tansell | can you remove the *.cfg files in the current directory? | 21:05 |
| tansell | my guess is that you might need to create your own plugin.cfg (base it from the demos one) | 21:05 |
| Landon | well | 21:06 |
| Landon | I'm looking through the code now | 21:06 |
| Landon | the only place that has the phrase keyerror is dealing with the client config | 21:06 |
| Landon | not plugin.cfg | 21:06 |
| Landon | line 162 of tpclient-pyogre | 21:06 |
| Landon | not sure where that's called from though | 21:06 |
| cherez | tansell: Should libtpproto2-py have an objects directory? | 21:08 |
| Landon | hm, the test_battle has an odd error too "python: OgreRoot.cpp:103: static Ogre::Root& Ogre::Root::getSingleton(): Assertion `ms_Singleton' failed." | 21:09 |
| tansell | cherez, not really | 21:13 |
| tansell | Landon, but I think i saw a similar problem with python-ogre having an incorrect plugins.cfg | 21:14 |
| cherez | Well, it depends on an objects module. | 21:15 |
| Landon | hm | 21:15 |
| Landon | it's pointing at /home/landon/development/root/usr/lib/OGRE right now | 21:15 |
| cherez | I touched up my application a bit, by the way. | 21:15 |
| Landon | which exists | 21:16 |
| Landon | and has all the plugin .so and .la's in it | 21:16 |
| alanp | hmm | 21:18 |
| Landon | tansell: success! I installed avbin | 21:22 |
| Landon | hrm | 21:22 |
| Landon | half success | 21:22 |
| llnz | cool, boost.asio is for C++ what twisted is for python (at the core, without all the protocol implmentations) | 21:22 |
| Landon | it got far enough in the client to give me the ms_Singleton assertion error | 21:22 |
| tansell | llnz, yeah - asio looks pretty cool | 21:25 |
| tansell | (and I say that as a C++ hater ;) | 21:25 |
| llnz | hehe | 21:26 |
| Landon | tansell: even more progress, I played a little bit on a demo server, but then it crashed :p | 21:27 |
| shenki | we use asio at work for doing stuff | 21:28 |
| shenki | apparently it's pretty awesome | 21:28 |
| llnz | shenki: cool | 21:33 |
| alanp | hello | 21:40 |
| llnz | hi alanp | 21:43 |
| alanp | llnz, hello, working on updates to proposal | 21:48 |
| alanp | how is your.... afternoon(?)? | 21:49 |
| llnz | afternoon, yes | 21:49 |
| llnz | busy, working | 21:50 |
| alanp | ah | 21:51 |
| *** nebajoth has quit IRC | 21:52 | |
| bddebian | Oh, llnz, shite I wanted to ask you something about tpserver-cpp but now I can't remember wtf it was. :( | 21:56 |
| llnz | bddebian: when you remember, ask here or email it | 21:57 |
| alanp | small problem | 21:58 |
| alanp | on the ubuntu package, tpserver-cpp errors out on a fresh install with "Could not read config file" | 21:59 |
| alanp | further investigation shows: | 21:59 |
| alanp | open("/etc/tpserver-cpp/tpserver.conf", O_RDONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory) | 21:59 |
| alanp | but the default install puts only this file in /etc/tpserver-cpp: | 21:59 |
| alanp | tpserver-cpp.conf | 21:59 |
| llnz | alanp: looks like the server asked for the wrong file | 22:00 |
| llnz | it's not a big problem, pass -C /etc/tpserver-cpp/tpserver-cpp.conf when calling tpserver-cpp | 22:01 |
| llnz | and I'll fix it for the next release | 22:01 |
| alanp | i just changed the filename, just thought that i would bring it to your attention :) | 22:02 |
| llnz | ok, thanks | 22:04 |
| alanp | is it ubuntu-specific? | 22:05 |
| llnz | not sure | 22:05 |
| llnz | did you install from deb package? | 22:05 |
| alanp | apt-get from your repo | 22:05 |
| alanp | so... yes | 22:05 |
| llnz | then it's probably interaction between the packaging and the server defaults | 22:06 |
| llnz | i will fix the server defaults | 22:06 |
| llnz | bbs, meeting | 22:06 |
| alanp | ok | 22:06 |
| *** didi has quit IRC | 22:07 | |
| mhilmi | any mentors around? | 22:12 |
| alanp | if you ask your question, they will respond to you | 22:17 |
| *** konr has quit IRC | 22:22 | |
| *** konr has joined #tp | 22:23 | |
| mithro | I'm around | 22:53 |
| mithro | well around a little bit | 22:53 |
| mithro | mhilmi: have you downloaded and compiled parsek yet? | 23:08 |
| mhilmi | Yeah I was able to get it to compile but basically when it connects to a server the window is just blank =/ | 23:09 |
| mithro | mhilmi: I think the message stuff works | 23:09 |
| mithro | mhilmi: including information about how far you think the client is currently is | 23:10 |
| mithro | and how far you have gotten with it | 23:10 |
| mithro | a patch or two to parsek wouldn't go astray either | 23:10 |
| mithro | mhilmi: have you talked with JLP? | 23:10 |
| mhilmi | Yeah I believe the messaging system works but it it primitive/ugly | 23:10 |
| mhilmi | Yeah I spoke with JLP but I'm guessing he is sleeping now so I'll get in touch with him tomorrow | 23:10 |
| mithro | mhilmi: it's probably a bad time at the moment :) | 23:11 |
| mithro | yeah - he will be a sleep | 23:11 |
| mhilmi | but yeah, I told him I would be submitting my draft proposal tonight | 23:11 |
| mithro | mhilmi: okay cool | 23:11 |
| mhilmi | I'll include a section detailing my current progress with Parsek and steps I've taken to prepare | 23:12 |
| mithro | mhilmi: that would be good | 23:12 |
| mithro | the proposal looks pretty good so far | 23:12 |
| mhilmi | thanks. I'll continue to try to improve it | 23:13 |
| mithro | mhilmi: I would like to see some mock-up of what you expect the UI to look like | 23:14 |
| mhilmi | Yeah that was also something I was planning on adding | 23:14 |
| mhilmi | any suggestions on the best way to do a mockup? | 23:14 |
| mhilmi | Would just building something basic in Qt be the best approach? | 23:14 |
| mithro | mhilmi: anything from scanned hand drawn pictures | 23:14 |
| mithro | to buidling something in Qt's equivalent to Glade would be okay | 23:15 |
| *** jnengland77 has joined #tp | 23:15 | |
| mhilmi | I'll look into that | 23:16 |
| alanp | llnz, ping | 23:22 |
| llnz | alanp: pong, but about to leave for 1-2 hr | 23:33 |
| alanp | llnz, In your feedback to me you mentioned that you wanted specific design specs, such as which classes will be created. I haven't really come to a spec yet and I'm currently browsing the existing ruleset. Do you have any suggestions on my progression through milestones so that I can plan ahead right now? | 23:36 |
| Landon | mithro: in your comment, you mentioned packaging, I haven't thought about that, what were you thinking of? | 23:37 |
| mithro | Landon: well, you want users at the end right? :P | 23:37 |
| mithro | Landon: users are not going to spend 3 days getting python-ogre compiled :) | 23:38 |
| Landon | right :P | 23:38 |
| llnz | alanp: not off hand sorry | 23:38 |
| llnz | bbl | 23:38 |
| Landon | heh, indeed | 23:38 |
| *** llnz has quit IRC | 23:38 | |
| Landon | so, I would have to package up python-ogre, is that what you're saying? | 23:38 |
| cherez | mithro: Should I be able to run the tests for libtpproto2-py? | 23:39 |
| *** Knio has quit IRC | 23:56 | |
| *** Vadtec has quit IRC | 23:56 | |
| *** mithro has quit IRC | 23:56 | |
| *** Demitar has quit IRC | 23:56 | |
| *** tuna-fish has quit IRC | 23:56 | |
| *** welterde has quit IRC | 23:56 | |
| *** tuna-fish has joined #tp | 23:57 | |
| *** Demitar has joined #tp | 23:57 | |
| *** welterde has joined #tp | 23:57 | |
| *** Vadtec has joined #tp | 23:57 | |
| *** Knio has joined #tp | 23:57 | |
| *** mithro has joined #tp | 23:57 | |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.17.2 by Marius Gedminas - find it at https://mg.pov.lt/irclog2html/!