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JLafont | mithro, you mentioned you would give me some feedback but I'm not sure where you are going to post it. | 00:02 |
---|---|---|
mithro | JLafont: sorry, I got distracted | 00:03 |
JLafont | mithro, oh its fine. | 00:03 |
JLafont | understandable after the 0.3.1 thing | 00:03 |
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andrei | Here's the first draft of my proposal: http://csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~abarbu/soc/thousand-parsec | 00:29 |
tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1iXj> (at csclub.uwaterloo.ca) | 00:29 |
andrei | mithro, Tell me what you think when you get around to reading it :) | 00:30 |
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JLafont | Hey llnz | 00:54 |
llnz | hi JLafont | 00:54 |
mithro | llnz: the servers are playing up | 01:06 |
mithro | demo1 has crashed | 01:06 |
llnz | oh? | 01:06 |
mithro | and demo2 won't let people create accounts | 01:06 |
llnz | hehe, rfts only allows 4 players | 01:06 |
llnz | demo1 restarted | 01:08 |
llnz | segfaulted, debugged | 01:08 |
mithro | llnz: know what is causing it? | 01:09 |
llnz | i think i know, fixing it anyway | 01:09 |
mithro | llnz: well that is a bit annoying :) | 01:09 |
llnz | it's because you wanted frigates instead of 2 scouts | 01:09 |
CIA-13 | llnz tpserver-cpp * r7175fbb23eb2 /modules/games/minisec/minisec.cpp: | 01:12 |
CIA-13 | Moved setting ships in new player's fleets so that the orderqueues exist. | 01:12 |
CIA-13 | Fixes segfaults. Caused by addShip checking for frigates to add the colonise | 01:12 |
CIA-13 | order to the list of allowed orders. | 01:12 |
llnz | fixed and demo1 updated and restarted | 01:13 |
mithro | llnz: why are order queues not managed by the objects? | 01:14 |
mithro | andrei: ping? | 01:14 |
llnz | because of when they get their ids, iirc | 01:15 |
llnz | or type | 01:15 |
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llnz | it's on my list to fix | 01:15 |
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mithro | andrei: ping? | 01:25 |
andrei | mithro, pong | 01:27 |
mithro | andrei: want some feedback on the application? | 01:27 |
andrei | mithro, Yes please | 01:27 |
mithro | andrei: okay - you need some more solid goals | 01:27 |
mithro | IE The AI will be able to colonise planets etc | 01:28 |
andrei | Ah, okies. I'll add that in tomorrow | 01:28 |
andrei | The idea is for it to be able to play a full game | 01:29 |
mithro | andrei: I know that your idea is more "natural" | 01:29 |
andrei | So colonization is a requirement :) | 01:29 |
mithro | But I'm a skeptic, so you'll need to show how and when you are going to meet real world goals | 01:30 |
andrei | mithro, Natural? Not at at all. It's just using actual AI techniques; most game AIs don't at all | 01:31 |
andrei | mithro, Okies, what would convince you? | 01:31 |
andrei | mithro, I can cite relevant research papers? | 01:31 |
mithro | andrei: I want hard and fast goals | 01:31 |
mithro | IE The AI will be able to do XYZ | 01:31 |
andrei | mithro, Okies | 01:32 |
mithro | andrei: I also want less theory and more practical information | 01:33 |
mithro | I don't expect to understand how it will work, but I want to see it doing so in good steps | 01:33 |
andrei | mithro, You mean more concrete goals? or something else? | 01:35 |
mithro | andrei: yes | 01:35 |
mithro | A goal like "inference engine works" is useless to me, a goal "AI is able to defeat tpsai-py" is a good one | 01:36 |
andrei | mithro, Sure; I'll add that tomorrow | 01:37 |
mithro | andrei: being able to package your stuff as a C++ library (so that nobody knows it is scheme) would be a bit plus | 01:37 |
andrei | mithro, Heh, sure; I can do that | 01:37 |
andrei | mithro, I was planning on having C bindings to it | 01:37 |
mithro | need to know more about your commitments, amount of time you plan to put in | 01:37 |
mithro | etc | 01:37 |
andrei | mithro, Oh. I assumed that full time was implied for SoC | 01:38 |
mithro | andrei: full time means different things to different people :) | 01:38 |
mithro | andrei: some information on your experiance with current open source stuff (if any) | 01:38 |
Landon | "Full time.... between my other 3 jobs" | 01:38 |
mithro | bblr have to hang out washing | 01:39 |
andrei | mithro, 40+ hours of work/week and I don't have another job is what full time means to me :) | 01:39 |
andrei | mithro, Okies, I can add more open source stuff. | 01:40 |
mithro | andrei: well mention that - do you have any family commitments? IE have to help build a house, etc | 01:40 |
andrei | mithro, Heh, no; none | 01:40 |
andrei | mithro, I live far away from any family :) | 01:41 |
andrei | mithro, Sure, I'll make those changes tomorrow | 01:41 |
andrei | mithro, Thanks :) | 01:43 |
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greywhind | mithro: sorry for not being around today to try to fix the packaging... I had to write an essay, and I just finished. | 01:57 |
mithro | greywhind: no probs | 01:57 |
mithro | I've been relaxing and playing computer games | 01:57 |
mithro | we get a long weekend because of easter | 01:57 |
greywhind | mithro: we had one as well, but I have school tomorrow, so i'm going to go sleep now | 01:59 |
mithro | greywhind: oh okay | 01:59 |
JLafont | greywhind: Good luck | 01:59 |
greywhind | JLafont: on the sleep? | 02:00 |
mithro | hey JLafont | 02:00 |
mithro | JLafont: what are your applications again? Just an AI? | 02:01 |
JLafont | greywhind: Class | 02:01 |
greywhind | JLafont: ah. thanks. | 02:01 |
JLafont | mithro: Yeah, I was thinking of maybe doing one for a 3D client as well, but I don't know If I should make more than one proposal | 02:01 |
mithro | JLafont: I would highly recommend it | 02:02 |
mithro | we are likely to only access a single AI proposal if we get a limited number of slots | 02:02 |
mithro | s/access/accept | 02:02 |
JLafont | Ok, I'll work on a 3D client proposal once I get back from break. | 02:03 |
JLafont | I fly out tomorrow, so I'll probably have a 3D proposal for feedback by tuesday | 02:04 |
JLafont | mithro, sorry to bug you, but did you manage to post the feedback on my application? | 02:04 |
mithro | JLafont: no, I can have another read in a minute | 02:05 |
mithro | JLafont: you heading to bed now? | 02:05 |
JLafont | mithro: Ok, just wondering. | 02:05 |
JLafont | mithro: No, I have to write an essay | 02:05 |
JLafont | mithro: So I'll be here for at least an hour | 02:05 |
mithro | JLafont: some of the above feedback for andrei will also apply to your proposal I think | 02:05 |
JLafont | ok | 02:06 |
mithro | JLafont: do want email or IRC? | 02:09 |
JLafont | mithro: Whichever one you prefer | 02:09 |
mithro | JLafont: I think you need to flesh out the middle of your application a little more - what/how are the sliders combined? how is the body of the AI going to work? | 02:13 |
mithro | some type of blueprint for the AI would be good | 02:13 |
mithro | expand on your experiance section | 02:14 |
JLafont | OK, the sliders are just percentages. I guess I should be a little more clear on how those would work. | 02:15 |
JLafont | mithro: By blueprint you mean like pseudocode? | 02:16 |
mithro | yes | 02:16 |
JLafont | mithro, ok thanks! I'll be sure to add more information. | 02:17 |
mithro | JLafont: I would love to see a python-ogre client | 02:18 |
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JLafont | yeah, I remember being able to put in lighting, shadows and objects in less than 10 minutes | 02:24 |
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mithro | JLafont: libRCPS might be useful for an AI | 02:25 |
JLafont | The first time I compiled it I was astonished at how easy and fun it was | 02:25 |
mithro | I have pondered using it in tpsai-py | 02:26 |
mithro | as tpsai-py is all about project planning/resource allocation | 02:26 |
JLafont | Yeah, thats generally what I'm going for as well. I'll be sure to look into it | 02:27 |
JLafont | Wow, I feel like the RCPS manual is writing my code for me. | 02:32 |
mithro | he he | 02:33 |
mithro | JLafont: I think a python-ogre client has a good chance for acceptance - specially since the competition seems less then in the AI area | 02:44 |
JLafont | mithro: Yeah, AI is a hot topic these days. I've had a general idea for a 3D client for a while, so I'll be sure to submit that proposal as well. I'd probably try to focus more on a good GUI than models | 02:47 |
mithro | yeah I agree | 02:47 |
mithro | but I think you could have a very very cool UI | 02:47 |
mithro | with things which fly out when you hover over stuff | 02:47 |
mithro | etc | 02:47 |
Ohm | good morning | 02:49 |
Ohm | mithro: you pinged me earlier? | 02:49 |
JLafont | that would be amazing. I'd try to make sure everything worked before I add all the special effects though. It would just be hard to keep myself from working on it all the time | 02:49 |
mithro | Ohm: you where interested in the schemepy stuff? | 02:49 |
Ohm | yes | 02:49 |
mithro | JLafont: I've often wondered about using something like flash to make the UI a little more interesting | 02:49 |
mithro | Ohm: I would recommend applying for it with both us and PSF | 02:50 |
mithro | they seem interested in mentoring it | 02:50 |
Ohm | PSF are the ones who've produced schemepy? | 02:50 |
mithro | nope | 02:50 |
mithro | I did :) | 02:50 |
Ohm | hah, ok | 02:50 |
mithro | PSF == Python Software Foundation | 02:50 |
Ohm | ah | 02:50 |
mithro | they do all Pythony stuff | 02:51 |
Ohm | That's a really good tip, thanks | 02:51 |
mithro | and schemepy is fairly general, not tp specific | 02:51 |
mithro | Ohm: make sure it's a good application - I'm happy to give feedback | 02:51 |
Ohm | I should be able to produce a first prototype by tomorrow evening | 02:53 |
mithro | Ohm: okay cool | 02:53 |
llnz | bbs, dinner | 02:59 |
JLafont | Alright time for me to go to sleep. Nite everyone | 03:13 |
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mithro | hey llnz | 04:06 |
mithro | how goes GSoC prep? | 04:06 |
mithro | btw, do you have a copy of the ruleset book somewhere? | 04:06 |
llnz | its in git, and at http://code.thousandparsec.net/~lee/ruleset-book.pdf iirc | 04:07 |
tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1i_X> (at code.thousandparsec.net) | 04:07 |
mithro | any updates recently? | 04:07 |
llnz | nope :-( | 04:07 |
llnz | gsoc it getting interesting | 04:07 |
llnz | lots of students | 04:07 |
mithro | yeah | 04:08 |
llnz | humm... jotham isn't around | 04:17 |
llnz | i'm in wellington tomorrow | 04:17 |
JLP | morning all | 06:58 |
llnz | hi JLP | 06:58 |
mithro | hey JLP | 07:01 |
JLP | llnz, mithro: ahoy | 07:08 |
* llnz is not looking forward to tomorrow | 07:08 | |
llnz | up early for flight, then meeting to give a demo where I have nothing to show, then late flight back | 07:09 |
mithro | llnz: sounds fun | 07:09 |
mithro | JLP: do you have a windows computer? | 07:10 |
JLP | mithro: nope, all 4 are 64-bit linux | 07:10 |
JLP | ah the servers seem to be back in order :) | 07:15 |
JLP | oh SmokingRope, hello there, didn't see you yesterday | 07:18 |
* llnz wanders off | 07:24 | |
llnz | later all | 07:24 |
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JLP | mithro: should there be a "don't show this again" option on the No Objects Warning dialog? | 07:30 |
mithro | JLP: when I implement it | 07:30 |
JLP | mithro: it looks like it pops up every time you update the universe after turn | 07:30 |
mithro | JLP: well you probably should have objects is your are going through turns | 07:32 |
JLP | mithro: not if you are logged in as gues and just watch the game | 07:33 |
mithro | guess so.... | 07:33 |
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CIA-13 | mithro tpclient-pywx-stable * r31e27c4aafd8 / (requirements.py version.py): Version bump (updated requirements too). | 07:58 |
CIA-13 | mithro tpclient-pywx-stable * ra485e7d2f265 /setup.py: Also include the Microsoft DLLs. | 07:58 |
CIA-13 | mithro web * r515d79f2b7b2 / (8 files in 4 dirs): Added 0.3.1 release of tpclient-pywx. | 08:11 |
mithro | JLP: ping? | 08:28 |
JLP | mithro: pong | 08:28 |
mithro | you pushed your change to a master branch again :/ | 08:28 |
JLP | mithro: i don't remember pushing anything after i pushed the translations to stable | 08:32 |
mithro | JLP: it looks like you didn't push to stable | 08:32 |
mithro | you pushed to master | 08:32 |
JLP | mithro: [09:06] <CIA-13> jlp tpclient-pywx-stable * r212676794228 /locale/sl/ (tpclient-pywx.mo tpclient-pywx.po): Updated Slovenian translations for the upcoming version 0.3.1 | 08:34 |
mithro | hrm.... | 08:34 |
mithro | oh it looks like you did | 08:34 |
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mithro | JLP: want to check the 0.3.1 release notes? | 08:39 |
JLP | mithro: sure | 08:39 |
mithro | sent | 08:39 |
JLP | mithro: Objects on the map are always sorted alphabetically now | 08:47 |
JLP | mithro: you mean in systems tree? | 08:47 |
mithro | JLP: nope, in the starmap | 08:47 |
mithro | in things like the pop-up | 08:47 |
JLP | mithro: ah there | 08:48 |
mithro | the system should always be alphabetical | 08:48 |
mithro | JLP: it makes things a little more predictable :) | 08:48 |
JLP | mithro: There are also been numerous fix for... -> There have also been numerous fixes for... | 08:50 |
JLP | or There are also numerous ... | 08:50 |
mithro | JLP: want to post the announcement? :) | 08:50 |
JLP | mithro: yup, can do | 08:50 |
mithro | thanks, I'm pretty tired | 08:51 |
mithro | I should be in bed | 08:51 |
mithro | we don't have Mac and Windows binaries yet | 08:51 |
CIA-13 | mithro tpclient-pywx-stable * r43ab0b3140c8 /TODO: | 08:53 |
CIA-13 | Updated the TODO a little. | 08:53 |
CIA-13 | (Testing the new update hook.) | 08:53 |
JLP | mithro: i think it's better to wait for them to be finished before writing the new | 08:53 |
mithro | uploading to sourceforge the window binaries | 08:54 |
JLP | mithro: i'll try to get my cousin on jabber to test them, i think he still keeps windows around | 08:55 |
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JLP | JLafont: ahoy | 08:58 |
JLafont | allo JLP | 09:00 |
mithro | JLP -> http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1609689&group_id=132078&atid=723099 | 09:01 |
tpb | Bug #1609689: Add link to main website from forum | 09:01 |
JLP | mithro: yeah i've already been thinking about this | 09:02 |
CIA-13 | mithro web * rbb644a461771 /downloads/tpclient-pywx/ (2 files): Added the windows binaries. | 09:10 |
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mithro | JLP: windows binaries uploaded | 09:27 |
mithro | JLP: think of anything else which needs to be done before I head to bed? | 09:35 |
JLP | mithro: i can't think of anything | 09:39 |
mithro | JLP: okay | 09:39 |
mithro | I'll reply to some of the GSoC applications tommorrow | 09:40 |
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JLP | Sontariel: ahoy | 09:56 |
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Sontariel | JLP, hi :) | 09:57 |
JLP | Sontariel: here for gsoc? | 09:58 |
Sontariel | maybe | 09:58 |
Sontariel | i found your project there | 09:58 |
Sontariel | im intrested in gamedev | 09:59 |
bddebian | Hi folks | 09:59 |
JLP | Sontariel: cool, so you're probably checking out what tp is all about and if there is anything that would be interesting on the ideas list | 09:59 |
JLP | bddebian: ahoy | 10:00 |
bddebian | Hello jlp | 10:00 |
JLP | Sontariel: btw, are you a gentoo user too? | 10:03 |
SmokingRope | good morning | 10:03 |
Sontariel | yes | 10:03 |
Sontariel | JLP, yes | 10:03 |
bddebian | Gentoo? What the hell is wrong with all these people? ;-P | 10:04 |
ezod | speaking of gentoo | 10:04 |
Sontariel | %) | 10:04 |
JLP | Sontariel: nice, a lot of us gentoo users here :) andrei and i think ezod too | 10:04 |
Sontariel | nice :) | 10:04 |
ezod | i was pinging you about those ebuilds yesterday JLP | 10:05 |
JLP | ezod: yeah i've seen, i've been sleeping | 10:05 |
ezod | i took some input from andrei's as well, and i've got a real nice set now | 10:05 |
ezod | i know a couple people who do ebuild reviews for sunrise, i'll see if i can get them in there | 10:06 |
JLP | ezod: awesome, mithro also wrote something about packages.thousandparsec.net | 10:06 |
ezod | JLP: yep, i noticed | 10:06 |
JLP | ezod: if any of you know how to create a overlay that is easily accessable thru layman or something send those instructions to mithro | 10:06 |
ezod | JLP: it's nothing difficult from mithro's end, but we need to get it added to the official layman list in order for 'layman -a thousand-parsec' or whatever to work | 10:08 |
JLP | ezod: yeah i thought so, don't remember seeing an option to add any URL to layman | 10:09 |
ezod | well, i'll see what i can do, i'll post the tree somewhere and link on the mailing list for comments first, i wanted andrei to have a look | 10:10 |
JLP | ezod: ok, cool | 10:11 |
ezod | oh, question | 10:11 |
ezod | er nm | 10:12 |
andrei | ezod, You want to add something to layman? | 10:19 |
ezod | andrei: we're talking about tp ebuilds | 10:19 |
ezod | JLP had already started some, and i was working on them | 10:20 |
ezod | so i kind of merged yours into them also, including your client patch | 10:20 |
ezod | more dependency info, etc. | 10:21 |
andrei | ezod, Ah, okies. | 10:30 |
andrei | ezod, If you want to get them into layman though you have to send email to [email protected] | 10:32 |
andrei | I sent one a few days ago but I haven't gotten a reply yet | 10:32 |
ezod | yeah | 10:32 |
ezod | i'll close a few arch testing bugs and then prod someone about it :) | 10:33 |
andrei | Heh, okies. Another option is to add them to the gentoo tree but the bugzilla thing is a huge pain in the ass | 10:35 |
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ezod | it would take forever right now | 10:35 |
andrei | And because bugs and ebuilds go into the same bin noone feels obliged to look at the ebuilds | 10:35 |
ezod | well, gentoo has a lot less devs than previously | 10:35 |
andrei | Yup; I am unsurprised :) | 10:36 |
andrei | I was a gentoo dev for ~1 month before I saw how it's run. Then I ran away screaming (this was.. 3-4 years ago) | 10:36 |
ezod | hehe | 10:37 |
andrei | I actually felt terrible using gentoo after seeing that. gentoo-core should definitely not be private | 10:37 |
JLP | Lukstr: hi | 10:37 |
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JLP | Epyon: yo | 10:38 |
andrei | ezod, Are you a dev? | 10:38 |
ezod | andrei: arch tester for sparc, i don't have time to be a dev ;) | 10:38 |
Lukstr | JLP, greetings | 10:38 |
ezod | andrei: although this summer i might sign up | 10:38 |
andrei | ezod, Nice :) | 10:39 |
ezod | andrei: btw, you're at waterloo? | 10:39 |
andrei | ezod, Well, if the stop sucking and open up I'd love to sign up too :P | 10:39 |
andrei | ezod, Not anymore. I'm at Purdue now | 10:40 |
ezod | ah | 10:40 |
andrei | ezod, You're a student there? | 10:40 |
ezod | nah, windsor | 10:40 |
andrei | ezod, Ah nice, in CS? | 10:40 |
ezod | ee | 10:40 |
ezod | i know a lot of cs/ee people at waterloo though, is why i asked | 10:40 |
andrei | ezod, Heh; I kind of got sucked into the EE department at Purdue | 10:41 |
Lukstr | ezod, what year? | 10:41 |
andrei | ezod, For some reason they feel it proper to put AI research in EE not CS.. | 10:41 |
ezod | Lukstr: grad students mostly.. | 10:41 |
Lukstr | ezod, ah | 10:41 |
Lukstr | I know a bunch of sydes | 10:41 |
ezod | andrei: it's all the same, my research is distributed algorithms and computer vision, which are both traditionally cs topics | 10:42 |
* ezod hits the Off-Topic Gnome for 5 damage | 10:43 | |
andrei | ezod, Heh, nice | 10:43 |
andrei | ezod, My advisor's main research are is vision | 10:43 |
ezod | we have a vision/ai group at windsor | 10:45 |
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andrei | ezod, Awesome; I had no clue | 10:46 |
andrei | ezod, I haven't really been keeping up with what's going in the gentoo leadership lately | 10:59 |
andrei | ezod, Are things looking better? | 10:59 |
* Lukstr has a crappy laptop battery | 11:00 | |
Lukstr | later all | 11:00 |
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Epyon | JLP, yo :) | 11:10 |
SmokingRope | I have put together a first draft of my Ogre 3D Client proposal if anyone would want to take a look: | 11:22 |
SmokingRope | http://easlnx01.eas.muohio.edu/~hannasm/thousand_parsec_proposal.html | 11:22 |
tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1ifg> (at easlnx01.eas.muohio.edu) | 11:22 |
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Epyon | SmokingRope, hint : non-codeproducing research should be done before the program start | 11:24 |
Epyon | That is if you want to maximize your chances :) | 11:24 |
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_brennan | woo GSOC apps start today, i should probably start typing mine, lol | 11:25 |
Epyon | Hint 2: calculate the risks involved, and write how you will deal with them | 11:26 |
Epyon | Hint 3: do a mockup or give some implementation/design ideas | 11:27 |
Epyon | Hint 4: clearly state the deliverables -- what you plan on having when the project ends | 11:27 |
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SmokingRope | i tried to hint at the pre-start research but i'll refine my definition a bit | 11:33 |
SmokingRope | i've got a intense class load, so *working it out before hand* is somewhat of a non-option unfourtanetly | 11:33 |
JLP | SmokingRope: you can also link to your existing code where you have been playing with ogre and stuff | 11:34 |
JLP | SmokingRope: also include the info on how many hours per day/week you plan for working on this | 11:35 |
SmokingRope | maybe i could mention that classes end may 9th and will be ready to begin shortly thereafter | 11:35 |
JLP | SmokingRope: yeah that would be a good think to include | 11:36 |
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ezod | andrei: sorry, took off for a bit. yes, i would say generally, things are looking up from, say, the past couple of years :) | 11:49 |
ezod | andrei: it really came to a head around new years with the whole drobbins thing, etc. | 11:50 |
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ezod | JLP, andrei: http://mavrinac.com/projects/tp/overlay/ | 17:12 |
tpb | Title: Index of /projects/tp/overlay (at mavrinac.com) | 17:13 |
andrei | ezod, I'll take a look | 17:13 |
andrei | ezod, Fancy. Manifests, changelogs, metadata files :P Way more work than I'd ever do | 17:14 |
ezod | cool, i had to do an evil patch on tp-pywx-installed to make it work with the gentoo games dirs | 17:14 |
ezod | andrei: JLP had already done most of that when he was trying to get it into the tree | 17:14 |
ezod | ah, i forgot about the locales stuff in tpclient-pywx | 17:15 |
JLP | ezod: awsome, thanks again for working on this | 17:15 |
ezod | np | 17:16 |
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ezod | i didn't use setup.py in tpclient-pywx because it doesn't do gentoo games dir stuff, not sure if what i did was the right approach :\ | 17:18 |
ezod | looks kludgy to me | 17:18 |
andrei | ezod, I opted to ignore the whole gentoo games thing :p | 17:19 |
andrei | JLP, When you get around to it; could you look at my SoC proposal? | 17:20 |
andrei | http://csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~abarbu/soc/thousand-parsec | 17:20 |
tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1iXj> (at csclub.uwaterloo.ca) | 17:20 |
JLP | andrei: oh, will have a look, i have another one open but keep getting distracted, the last distraction that is now gone is familiy visiting for holidays :) | 17:22 |
JLP | oh yeah happy easter to all | 17:22 |
andrei | JLP, Heh; thanks :) | 17:26 |
JLP | oh i see the submition of applications to google system has already been opened | 17:28 |
mithro | you should be using setup.py and using the --prefix stuff? | 17:54 |
JLP | andrei: nice an detailed proposal, you should also add the times to delivarables, and maybe break down thse delivarables into a bit more detail | 17:55 |
JLP | andrei: i also miss risk managment section, what if some bad thing happens, what is planned to minimise the affect on TP and completion of the gsoc project | 17:56 |
andrei | JLP, Sure; I'll both in | 17:57 |
andrei | erm add | 17:57 |
mithro | well we have the first official application | 17:58 |
JLP | mithro: what's the link to mentors interface again | 17:58 |
andrei | JLP, Any other comments or concerns? | 17:58 |
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JLP | oh i see a new proposal for ruleset on forum | 17:59 |
JLP | easy_code: ahoy | 17:59 |
easy_code | msg/ JLP oh, um no. i was just intrested in you google summer of code program | 18:01 |
JLP | easy_code: cool, any particular idea cought your interest | 18:01 |
JLP | mithro: does graywhind usually do the mac os packages? | 18:02 |
mithro | yes | 18:04 |
mithro | s/graywhind/greywhind | 18:04 |
Epyon | damn americans :P | 18:06 |
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JLP | anyone knows Tigris and Euphrates board game? | 18:42 |
ezod | JLP: heard of it, but that's all | 18:52 |
mithro | JLP: want to add more "ranks" to the Forums? | 18:54 |
JLP | ok looks like a very interesting ruleset to port into space environemnt | 18:54 |
JLP | mithro: sure, if anyone has any imagination for the names of them :) | 18:54 |
mithro | JLP: go have a look at the FreeOrion forums? :) | 18:55 |
mithro | Cool to see that PocketPC client stuff | 18:55 |
JLP | mithro: yeah i recongnised space krill form there | 18:55 |
greywhind | mithro: want to do some troubleshooting of the packaging now? | 18:55 |
mithro | greywhind: I'm at work, but I may be able to do a little | 18:55 |
greywhind | mithro: so do you still think I should reinstall everything? | 18:56 |
greywhind | oh, and should I register on the forums? | 18:56 |
mithro | greywhind: well - give it a fresh go now and see what happens | 18:56 |
JLP | mithro: i'll check out the ranks from FreeOrion and Stars! Autohost forums and probably do a mix of them and maybe throw in one of my dubious ideas in | 18:59 |
mithro | he he | 18:59 |
mithro | feel free to ask for suggestions | 19:00 |
JLP | mithro: i'll add the page about that to wiki | 19:00 |
mithro | okay | 19:00 |
mithro | I think the post count should grow pretty quickly | 19:01 |
mithro | IE First rank change at 5 then 15, 40, 70, 150, 200, 500, 1000 ? | 19:01 |
mithro | JLP: can you also add llnz as an admin and give me the ability to add admin users? | 19:02 |
JLP | mithro: i think llnz is already in admin group | 19:02 |
mithro | JLP: wasn't the last time I check? | 19:03 |
mithro | JLP: btw - you have all the site-ground details right? So if I get hit by a bus you can take over owner ship of the site? | 19:03 |
ApacheChief | Hey Mithro, could I bother you for a minute or two? (or anyone else :)) | 19:03 |
mithro | ApacheChief: I would recommend just asking on the channel | 19:04 |
ApacheChief | alright | 19:04 |
JLP | mithro: yeah i think i have everything needed | 19:04 |
mithro | I may or may not have time depending on the question | 19:04 |
ApacheChief | Well, I've been doing a lot of research on possible web clients, but I haven't found any decent solutions yet. With PHP/HTML I figure I'll hvae to keep re-connecting to the server every time I issue a request or anything like that, which doesn't seem very smooth -- am I right about that? | 19:05 |
JLP | mithro: yeah llnz is listedin admins, global moderators and registered users | 19:05 |
JLP | admins being the default | 19:05 |
mithro | ApacheChief: you will need some type of proxy running on the server to stop the need for multiple connections | 19:05 |
mithro | which could be something like fastcgi or something | 19:06 |
mithro | or your own daemon | 19:06 |
ApacheChief | Alright, I'll keep researching using a couple of those words that I'm not familiar with--thanks :) | 19:06 |
greywhind | mithro: well, I still am getting the error "AttributeError: 'module' object has no attribute 'VisualAttributes_font_get'" | 19:06 |
mithro | greywhind: :/ | 19:06 |
mithro | greywhind: I was successfully able to build a dmg on my 10.5 mac at home | 19:07 |
greywhind | mithro: maybe I could upload my DMG and then someone could test it on another Mac and tell me if they get the same error? | 19:09 |
mithro | greywhind: I don't really have access to a mac at the moment | 19:10 |
mithro | anyone else here got a Mac? | 19:10 |
greywhind | mithro: well, you could always check it later then tell me | 19:10 |
mithro | well currently the Mac dmg is the only thing holding back the release :( | 19:11 |
greywhind | mithro: i'm going to try reinstalling wxWidgets | 19:11 |
mithro | greywhind: didn't you have multiple macs locally? - can you test with them? | 19:11 |
greywhind | mithro: the others are running 10.3 :( | 19:12 |
greywhind | i would have another 10.4, but it's in Georgia at the moment. | 19:12 |
mithro | greywhind: dang :/ | 19:12 |
greywhind | mithro: i'm just hoping this wxWidgets compile doesn't take hours... | 19:16 |
mithro | compile? | 19:16 |
greywhind | mithro: they seemed to only have an official source distribution for mac | 19:17 |
greywhind | so i'm compiling it | 19:17 |
mithro | i'm sure they have binaries | 19:17 |
mithro | http://downloads.sourceforge.net/wxpython/wxPython2.8-osx-unicode-2.8.7.1-universal-py2.5.dmg | 19:17 |
tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1ZSA> (at downloads.sourceforge.net) | 19:17 |
greywhind | mithro: i see | 19:19 |
mithro | compiling from source will break stuff :( | 19:19 |
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JLP | vi1985: hey, congrats for the firs official applicai | 19:19 |
JLP | application | 19:20 |
vi1985 | JPL, thanks :) I slaved on it for a while... now time to catch up on coursework :)) | 19:20 |
greywhind | mithro: your link breaks my browser.. | 19:20 |
mithro | greywhind: ? | 19:20 |
greywhind | mithro: causes my browser to crash | 19:21 |
JLP | vi1985: btw you will be able to edit it and fix the mistakes once one of the mentors adds a comment | 19:21 |
mithro | greywhind: curl :) | 19:21 |
mithro | curl http://downloads.sourceforge.net/wxpython/wxPython2.8-osx-unicode-2.8.7.1-universal-py2.5.dmg > wxPython2.8-osx-unicode-2.8.7.1-universal-py2.5.dmg | 19:21 |
tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1ZSA> (at downloads.sourceforge.net) | 19:21 |
greywhind | mithro: nah, Firefox works | 19:21 |
vi1985 | JLP: oh, ok, great. BTW, what is the usual applicant/acceptance ratio, and what are you guys expecting this year? | 19:21 |
vi1985 | JLP: those weren't serious mistakes though.. maybe I was just being pedantic :) | 19:22 |
mithro | vi1985: last year we have 4 students out of 50 applications, we are hopeing to get more slots this year | 19:22 |
JLP | vi1985: yeah it was like 1:10, it would be nice to have something like 1:5 this year as is the case in kde i think | 19:23 |
vi1985 | JLP: :0 It's tougher than grad school ;) | 19:23 |
JLP | vi1985: yeah it is not exactly a piece of cake :) that's why it is so important to talk to the mentors before and to put as much effort as possible into the application | 19:24 |
mithro | what was the overall acceptance rate? | 19:24 |
mithro | vi1985: the AI stuff is going to be tough, it looks like at a minimum we will get 3 very good applications | 19:25 |
vi1985 | JLP: I hope that showed in my application ;) | 19:25 |
JLP | vi1985: maybe putting two application in also helps a bit with the odds | 19:25 |
easy_code | what was the reason so many students were rejected? | 19:25 |
vi1985 | mithro: thx for the heads up.. .everyone wants to play mad scientist! :P | 19:25 |
mithro | easy_code: we only got a very small number of slots from google | 19:26 |
JLP | easy_code: limited number of slots that google has and distributes among organizations | 19:26 |
vi1985 | JLP: if I put even 1/3 of the effort in designing additional project proposals, I'll be doing it all week long! | 19:27 |
vi1985 | JLP: Besides, AI is _really_ what I want to do, so I'll take the chance :) | 19:28 |
JLP | vi1985: yeah i know, but then again you can reuse some parts and experiences from the first one, and additional high quality application can mean that we get more slots in the end and you can put the second application for the idea that maybe gets less competition | 19:28 |
greywhind | mithro: rebuilding the package again | 19:29 |
mithro | greywhind: I have my fingers crossed | 19:29 |
greywhind | mithro: oh, so do I... | 19:29 |
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vi1985 | JLP: what would be a project that people haven't shown much interest in for TP? | 19:30 |
* JLP bows a few times into the direction of Cupertino :) | 19:31 | |
mithro | Last year Google received nearly 6,200 applications. | 19:31 |
JLP | vi1985: hm the protocol libraries testing suite would be very usefull | 19:32 |
greywhind | mithro: same error. | 19:32 |
mithro | greywhind: :( | 19:32 |
mithro | my only other suggestion is to remove your Python install completely and then reinstall | 19:33 |
JLP | vi1985: i laso hope to see more applications for development tools, to make it easier to build rulesets for example | 19:33 |
greywhind | mithro: i may... i'm going to try just numpy first | 19:33 |
mithro | actually - did you google for the error? | 19:33 |
greywhind | mithro: hmm... no, i didn't, surprisingly enough | 19:34 |
mithro | btw, it will put logs in ~/.tp/ now | 19:34 |
vi1985 | JLP: JLP: I see that most of what's on TP is done on Python. Would development in Java be a problem? | 19:34 |
mithro | instead of the old logs.txt | 19:34 |
vi1985 | JLP: Java is my mother tongue, you know ;P | 19:34 |
JLP | vi1985: i don't think so, we already have one development tool in java | 19:34 |
JLP | vi1985: http://git.thousandparsec.net/gitweb/gitweb.cgi?p=tpruledev.git;a=summary | 19:36 |
tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1b_u> (at git.thousandparsec.net) | 19:36 |
JLP | vi1985: there is also a protocol library in Java | 19:36 |
vi1985 | JLP: hm... I really would rather be selected for AI dev. (especially since I put in a lot of thought into the design!), but then again, doing something else isn't that bad at all :) | 19:36 |
vi1985 | JLP: let me check the link out... | 19:37 |
JLP | vi1985: java lib - http://git.thousandparsec.net/gitweb/gitweb.cgi?p=libtpproto-java.git;a=summary | 19:38 |
tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1iqA> (at git.thousandparsec.net) | 19:38 |
mithro | JLP: tpruledev is written in python | 19:38 |
mithro | JLP: you are thinking of starmapper :) | 19:39 |
mithro | which is an external project | 19:39 |
JLP | vi1985: as i said two applications in two different categories can help, because it is highly probable that there will be more great applications where people have put a lot of thought into it and we will not have enough slots for all of what we would like to accept | 19:39 |
mithro | http://starmapper.sourceforge.net/wikka/HomePage | 19:39 |
tpb | <http://ln-s.net/1apo> (at starmapper.sourceforge.net) | 19:39 |
vi1985 | JLP: yeah, I've had the chance to browse through the libtpproto-java library already. | 19:40 |
JLP | mithro: oh, maybe he just did the prototpes in java | 19:40 |
mithro | JLP: yeah the prototypes where in Java | 19:40 |
vi1985 | JLP: statistically, youre right :) | 19:40 |
JLP | mithro: ah that's why i still have in my mind that tpruledev is in java | 19:41 |
mithro | we need someone to give tpruledev some love | 19:41 |
greywhind | mithro: from googling, a similar question on a mailing list gave this answer: "Thank you! Removing the old dist folder before py2exe-ing indeed did the trick." | 19:42 |
vi1985 | JLP: Ah... I'll just ride it out as it is. I've got two big projects in data structures and computability to finish before the exams... I wish I could give it more time. | 19:42 |
mithro | greywhind: well - I guess give it a go | 19:43 |
* vi1985 *Life* | 19:43 | |
vi1985 | JLP: plus, i've got some faith in my current proposal ;) | 19:43 |
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JLP | vi1985: yeah this nasty life | 19:43 |
greywhind | mithro: nope. :( | 19:44 |
vi1985 | JLP: lol, it's bearable, just too many things to do! :) Anyway, i got to get back to my project... thanks for the help, though, I appreciate it! | 19:45 |
mithro | greywhind: actually have you tried the following | 19:45 |
* vi1985 *Does not like proving properties of Turing machines* | 19:45 | |
mithro | cg-clean -D | 19:46 |
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mithro | cg-clean -D -x | 19:46 |
mithro | and a | 19:47 |
mithro | git reset --hard | 19:47 |
greywhind | mithro: trying it | 19:47 |
mithro | that should remove every rements of previous builds | 19:47 |
greywhind | mithro: i had to do the scratchpad setup again | 19:48 |
mithro | greywhind: yes | 19:48 |
greywhind | so i'd assume it's all clean | 19:48 |
mithro | a | 19:49 |
mithro | cg-status -w | 19:49 |
mithro | should output nothing | 19:49 |
greywhind | mithro: success!!! | 19:50 |
mithro | oh? | 19:50 |
greywhind | mithro: that was apparently the problem. | 19:50 |
mithro | maybe we should make that part of the build process | 19:50 |
greywhind | mithro: probably a good idea | 19:51 |
andrei | JLP, Hi | 19:51 |
greywhind | clean everything, re-do the setup, then build the app | 19:51 |
JLP | andrei: ahoy | 19:51 |
greywhind | mithro: now, this is a fully updated build... is that what you want for the release? or is there a previous tag I should build at? | 19:52 |
mithro | I have not pushed any new changes | 19:53 |
andrei | JLP, I wanted to ask about my proposal; I'm not quite sure what else to add to the deliverables. I made a risk management section and added a comment about speed. But I'm not quite sure what other risks you had in mind? | 19:53 |
greywhind | mithro: ok then. the package is built. where do i upload it again? | 19:53 |
mithro | greywhind: upload it to your public_html again | 19:54 |
greywhind | mithro: you'll have to remind me of the exact command, i'm afraid | 19:55 |
mithro | scp <file> [email protected]:~/public_html/ | 19:55 |
JLP | andrei: for example if you would go with scheme, put down what you would do to minimise the risk in case you would not be able to continu work, for example like you said bindings, maybe you could try to invite some other scheme develoepr to join TP, since you know the scheme community, things like that | 19:55 |
JLP | andrei: in more detailed delivarables i though about something like: * the AI can colonize a planet, the AI knows how to ... | 19:56 |
mithro | I think it's going to be FSCKING hard to choose applications this year :) | 19:56 |
mithro | s/:)/:(/ | 19:56 |
mithro | well I guess it is both a :) because it means we are getting high quality applications and :( because it sucks to reject good applications | 19:57 |
JLP | mithro: yeah in kde they also say it ios getting harder, each year there are more high quality applications | 19:58 |
andrei | JLP, Ah ok, I mentioned the colonization. I basically want it to do everything that's normal for a beginnig player. Colonize, attack, deal with economy, etc. Though each won't be of extremely high quality :) | 19:58 |
greywhind | mithro: 6 minutes left | 19:58 |
mithro | greywhind: cool | 19:58 |
JLP | andrei: yeah i know you probably have all this in mind, but do break it down into "chewable" pieces so that the progress can also be nicely monitored | 19:59 |
mithro | ~seen bddebian | 19:59 |
tpb | mithro: bddebian was last seen in #tp 9 hours, 54 minutes, and 56 seconds ago: <bddebian> Gentoo? What the hell is wrong with all these people? ;-P | 19:59 |
andrei | JLP, Okies | 19:59 |
JLP | andrei: it has to be in some way that even a persion who knows nothing about the AI stuff or TP stuff can take something and check it out and see aha this point is reached | 20:01 |
greywhind | mithro: it's done, by the way | 20:05 |
mithro | greywhind: cool | 20:07 |
greywhind | any problems, let me know | 20:08 |
mithro | greywhind: I managed to save a whole 3mb in this release! :P | 20:08 |
greywhind | pretty good | 20:08 |
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mithro | http://www.thousandparsec.net/~nathan/ | 20:08 |
tpb | Title: Index of /~nathan (at www.thousandparsec.net) | 20:08 |
mithro | greywhind: feel free to chuck up other tp related stuff there if you need to | 20:09 |
greywhind | mithro: k | 20:09 |
_brennan_afk | hey guys | 20:09 |
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JLP | looks like Stars! Autohost Forums use Star Trek ranks | 20:11 |
JLP | _brennan: ahoy | 20:12 |
mithro | Major Ensin ;) | 20:13 |
Epyon | mithro, JLP, how many 3d client proposals up to date? | 20:21 |
mithro | Epyon: at the moment none - but I expect 1 before long | 20:21 |
Epyon | I mean "expected" :) | 20:21 |
SmokingRope | i am working on one :) | 20:22 |
Epyon | I'm finalizing my ideas for this year's GSoC | 20:22 |
Epyon | So I can start writing apps tommorow | 20:22 |
JLP | Epyon: my incomplete spy files show 2 interested in 3d client | 20:22 |
mithro | I think Jlafont is doing a python-ogre 3d client proposal | 20:23 |
JLP | mithro: yup, the other one is jmtan | 20:23 |
SmokingRope | mithro: did you get the 0.3.1 client fixed ? | 20:24 |
_brennan | hey, anything proposals for the metaserver? i know one guy was posting other then myself on the forums, anyone else? | 20:26 |
mithro | SmokingRope: I think it was server issues | 20:26 |
mithro | SmokingRope: can you give the windows binary on sf a go? | 20:26 |
JLP | _brennan: hm i only have you listed as interested into metaserver | 20:27 |
_brennan | ok, well now that i finally kinda got a grip on how it was working thanks to mithro giving me those details the other day, im gonna start working on my proposal | 20:28 |
JLP | _brennan: ah no, there are two of you | 20:28 |
_brennan | k | 20:28 |
mithro | JLP: do you want to post your cheat-sheet on Google Docs and share it with me? :) | 20:29 |
JLP | mithro: sure | 20:29 |
SmokingRope | mithro: it seems to work now | 20:30 |
JLP | SmokingRope: i think it was something wrong with the servers | 20:30 |
JLP | SmokingRope: they also weren't working for me yesterday | 20:30 |
mithro | SmokingRope: cool - that had all the dll's in it you needed? | 20:33 |
SmokingRope | it had the dll's | 20:33 |
SmokingRope | i think i remember how you can remove the dependency entirely | 20:35 |
JLP | mithro: what is your google account | 20:35 |
SmokingRope | in the project property pages go to c++->code generation->runtime library and set it to the non dll versions | 20:36 |
mithro | [email protected] | 20:36 |
mithro | SmokingRope: ahh, but this is a python project :) | 20:36 |
mithro | no compiling here | 20:36 |
SmokingRope | that doesn't apply for python projects | 20:37 |
Epyon | I'm toying with the idea of a OGRE/C++ 3d client proposal myself :> | 20:37 |
JLP | mithro: invitation for collaboration sent | 20:38 |
SmokingRope | have you worked with Ogre before? | 20:38 |
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JLP | nightlyhawk: ahoy there | 20:39 |
Epyon | SmokingRope, nope. But it can't be harder than writing a 3d client yourself :P | 20:39 |
nightlyhawk | hi guys | 20:39 |
Epyon | 3d engine* | 20:40 |
mithro | JLP: thanks | 20:40 |
mithro | Epyon: you should investigate python-ogre it's like C++ ogre but a hundred times more fun :) | 20:40 |
nightlyhawk | i really appreciate your collection of links on writing proposals as well as your list of selection criteria :) | 20:41 |
Epyon | mithro, I don't feel proficient with python, and I much more need to extend my c++ skills :P | 20:42 |
JLP | nightlyhawk: great to know or work is usefull :) | 20:42 |
JLP | nightlyhawk: any idea especially grabbed your interest? | 20:42 |
mithro | nightlyhawk: we also appreciate any additions or similar to add to that page | 20:43 |
nightlyhawk | JLP: i am very interested in AI stuff. the AI client sounds like a good challenge | 20:46 |
JLP | nightlyhawk: the AI club is getting quite large :) | 20:46 |
JLP | nightlyhawk: i think you are like 4th or 5th | 20:47 |
nightlyhawk | JLP: i can understand why. AI's quite fun to work at :D | 20:47 |
SmokingRope | i don't think the server is sick again | 20:48 |
SmokingRope | *do think | 20:49 |
nightlyhawk | mithro: some mentors seem to like it if the proposal also includes a bit on the personal motivation of the student. like why he/she is interested in the particular project. don't know if that's true for you as well. but if so, you could add that to the list | 20:51 |
JLP | nightlyhawk: yeah it is a nice thing to add, you can also register and edit the page yourself, wiki remeber | 20:52 |
mithro | nightlyhawk: yes, that is very good | 20:53 |
mithro | SmokingRope: oh, what is happening now? | 20:53 |
SmokingRope | i can't even login with the guest account ? | 20:53 |
SmokingRope | it wasn't me! | 20:53 |
mithro | looks like demo1 is dead :( | 20:56 |
nightlyhawk | JLP: done :) | 21:01 |
JLP | nightlyhawk: cool | 21:02 |
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bddebian | Howdy | 21:06 |
JLP | bddebian: ciao | 21:07 |
bddebian | Hello JLP | 21:07 |
JLP | bddebian: i think mithro was looking for you before | 21:08 |
mithro | hey bddebian | 21:08 |
mithro | 0.3.1 release uploaded | 21:09 |
mithro | just not announced yet | 21:09 |
bddebian | Uh oh.. :-) | 21:09 |
bddebian | Hi mithro | 21:09 |
bddebian | Yeah I was hoping to start on some packages tonight maybe | 21:09 |
bddebian | But it sounds like everyone loves Gentoo so I decided not to do it... | 21:10 |
* bddebian hides | 21:10 | |
mithro | bddebian: no, just ignore the gentoo people | 21:11 |
* ezod stomps feet and screams | 21:13 | |
bddebian | heh | 21:14 |
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mithro | typical gentoo user ;) | 21:18 |
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JLP | good night @ all, see you in a few hours | 21:26 |
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bddebian | Gnight | 21:26 |
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jphr | mithro: howdy | 22:03 |
jphr | JLP: howdy? | 22:05 |
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mithro | sorry was at lunch | 22:20 |
mithro | back now | 22:20 |
jphr | mithro: sokay | 22:21 |
jphr | mithro: just wondering if you had possibly seen my draft proposal, and if so, did you have any pointers? | 22:22 |
bddebian | mithro: libtpproto-py is up for Debian | 22:22 |
mithro | bddebian: cool | 22:34 |
mithro | jphr: I did and I do - but i'm at work so can't chat now | 22:35 |
jphr | mithro: okay, when would be good to talk, or do you prefer an email? | 22:37 |
mithro | i'll be around later tonight - in about 5-6 hours | 22:38 |
jphr | mithro: I'll set my alarm :P (north american goonie here) | 22:38 |
mithro | I can do email too | 22:38 |
jphr | mithro: that would be appreciated, I can reply some time 12-18 hrs later at school | 22:38 |
jphr | mithro: g'night | 22:42 |
mithro | gnight | 22:43 |
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bddebian | Hmm, wtf | 22:50 |
bddebian | Traceback (most recent call last): | 22:50 |
bddebian | File "setup.py", line 115, in ? | 22:51 |
bddebian | shutil.copytree('graphics', graphicspath_temp) | 22:51 |
bddebian | File "/usr/lib/python2.4/shutil.py", line 111, in copytree | 22:51 |
bddebian | os.mkdir(dst) | 22:51 |
bddebian | OSError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/tmp/buildd/tpclient-pywx-0.3.1/debian/tpclient-pywx/usr/share/tpclient-pywx/graphics' | 22:51 |
mithro | hrm.... | 22:53 |
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mithro | bddebian: where you able to figure out what is causing that? | 23:20 |
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bddebian | Not yet, I'm in the middle of a couple of things at once :-( | 23:22 |
mithro | the joys of being a packager? :) | 23:23 |
bddebian | Something like that :) | 23:23 |
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JLafont | mwuahaha, I survived my flight | 23:40 |
mithro | JLafont: yay! | 23:40 |
JLafont | now to fix my AI proposal and start the 3D client one | 23:43 |
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