Monday, 2009-06-15

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jamtoday1ajaksu: the changes in the survey view in your latest changeset look incomplete....or at least it's throwing a TemplateSyntaxError02:32
ajaksujamtoday1: in what page? local or remote instance?02:36
jamtoday1local...i just pulled from your bitbucket02:36
jamtoday1when creating a new survey02:36
ajaksuI've just pushed to github, but didn't test creation actually :)02:37
ajaksuyup, 500 error on remote02:37
jamtoday1do you have a hook to update the production server, or are you doing it manually?02:37
ajaksujust running appcfg.py update build frequently :)02:38
ajaksujamtoday1: fixed the error, JS isn't working yet :)02:47
jamtoday1i'll merge with your next changeset...i have a few new things to cherry pick in02:51
ajaksujamtoday1: aha, I forgot to add your <tbody></tbody> fix to the template :)03:01
ajaksujamtoday1: pushed to github and bitbucket :)03:05
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ajaksujamtoday1: when you say "I've merged upstream but it looks like some things are now broken." is upstream me, http://soc.googlecode.com/hg/ or ...?03:15
tpbTitle: Revision c61d96e72e: / (at soc.googlecode.com)03:15
ajaksujamtoday1: I have to sleep now, but I think I'm starting to get the user<->project<->program<->survey query, can we chat later today?03:26
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jamtoday1ajaksu: yes, speakers turned up to 100% in case I'm pinged.05:03
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* lh waits patiently for today's con call to start15:03
* ajaksu frantically tries to get the mic working with skype15:04
lhlooks like lennard is having some internet connection woes, asks us to give him 10 minutes15:05
lhin the meantime, greets all, how are you doing?15:05
* lh notes cricket noises, goes back to her email.15:06
jamtodaydoing pretty well! how about yourself15:07
* jamtoday needs to get audio working in his IRC client15:07
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Lennie|Andythis sucks :(15:07
Lennie|Andythe radius server here is down15:08
Lennie|Andywhole building without internet15:08
jamtodaythe horror15:09
Lennie|Andyyes15:09
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lhi am doing very well thanks15:11
* lh apologizes for falling down an "i'm smitten and getting nothing done" hole15:11
lhLennie|Andy: what do you want us to do my friend? reschedule, move on without you?15:11
MatthewWilkeslh!  :)15:11
lhwe could meet here i guess but i know you hate the irc meetings15:11
lhMatthewWilkes: hello dear! :)15:11
Lennie|Andyi so hate them15:11
lhMatthewWilkes: when are you getting yourself to CA next15:12
Lennie|Andyim on android sucks even more15:12
lhLennie|Andy: i know. i can give out a conference call line if that helps15:12
lhyou can expense the call....15:12
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Lennie|Andyhi pawel15:12
Meriowb :)15:12
MatthewWilkeslh: If Plone gets invited to the mentor summit and there are no community objections to me representing us, then.  I'm in the US in september, but that's indy and florida.15:13
solydzajsyo yo15:13
solydzajs:-)15:13
lhMatthewWilkes: ok. noted.15:13
Lennie|Andyoh nice matthew15:13
* lh adds to mental calendar of where everyone is when15:13
Lennie|Andyi meet you there i guess :D15:13
lhLennie|Andy: you have the floor lennard, what do you want us to do?15:13
lhwoot!15:13
Lennie|Andyfix my internet :P15:13
Lennie|Andyis ajaksu on irc?15:14
solydzajsajaksu: ping15:14
ajaksuLennie|Andy: yup15:14
MerioLennie|Ansy: Sounds challenging :)15:14
MerioLennie|Andy: ^^15:14
Merio:P15:14
lhLennie|Andy: grrr. please to tell me something to do that i actually can do.15:14
* lh *hates* not being able to solve problems.15:14
Lennie|Andyhehe15:14
solydzajsLennie|Andy: I'd suggest that we reschedule the meeting if you won't get your internet back in 5-10 minutes15:15
Lennie|Andyi was about to type thay15:15
Lennie|Andybut andy types slow ^^15:15
solydzajs:-)15:15
lhdon't hate on the andy. :)15:16
Lennie|Andyin the meantime15:17
Lennie|Andyajaksu15:17
Lennie|Andysurveys15:17
Lennie|Andyhow confident do you feel :d15:17
ajaksuLennie|Andy: on IRC? I'm so lucky, my audio is a mess :)15:18
Lennie|Andyhehe15:18
Lennie|Andymy internet is down :915:18
Lennie|Andyso yes on irc15:18
jamtodayajaksu has made some great progress on surveys15:19
Lennie|Andysome access issues still need to be solved ?15:19
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ajaksuconfident enough to say this: lh, if you are not able to create surveys the way you want, I'll consider my participation a failure, so the sooner you can test drive surveys the better :)15:19
jamtodaywe've been talking about solving the permissions issues15:19
Lennie|Andyhi daniel15:19
Meriodhans: heya :)15:19
lhajaksu: done, how do i test15:19
dhansHey y'll!15:19
lhi am on the road for the next three days and given how little i sleep while traveling i can be up late testing15:20
jamtodaylh: we have a staging server up....let me deploy to make sure it's up to date15:20
jamtodaymine is up at http://jamstage.appspot.com15:20
lhperfection.15:20
solydzajsajaksu: can you post surveys testing guidelines on the group so we can all test ?15:20
tpbTitle: Sign In Required (at jamstage.appspot.com)15:20
lhjamtoday: thanks.15:20
ajaksulh: http://melange-ajaksu.appspot.com/, you should have a pending invitation for developer, but I suggest you try to take some of the available surveys as a regular user before you get superpowers :)15:20
lhright, i have two different gmail accounts so i can do testing. will plan to do so as regular user first. please plan for feedback from me on wednesday (maybe tuesday night if i am lucky)15:21
solydzajsajaksu: where is the latest surveys module source code ? it's on james or yours repo ?15:21
Lennie|Andyis the permission issue still going to be solved by a dropdown?15:21
ajaksusolydzajs: I think we're in sync, let me check15:22
solydzajsajaksu: thx15:22
jamtodayA dropdown may be needed in case students or mentors have more than one project (will just apply for mentors, actually)15:22
Lennie|Andynot per say we dont force them to have one15:23
jamtodayBut that can be added only if there's more than one project. I still need to fix the query method that figures out what project links a survey taker to a program15:23
Lennie|Andygive it as a get param?15:23
Lennie|Andyand make sure to check on get and post?15:24
solydzajsLennie|Andy:  ok it has been 9 minutes, I'm going to send an email that conference call is postponed for tomorrow and update wiki to 16th of June15:25
ajaksujamtoday: what is the goal of that query? I think I can do it, but I don't know exactly what 'it' is :)15:25
ajaksusolydzajs: yup, we're in sync :)15:25
solydzajsajaksu: ok I will have a look then15:25
Lennie|Andyk thanks pawel15:25
ajaksujamtoday: is your github repo in sync with the main hg branch?15:26
lhi can't make a con call tomorrow at that time - i have a meeting. i can cancel it but would prefer not to. lennie, whatcha want me to do?15:28
jamtodayajaksu: I try to keep it up to date...merging upstream now15:28
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solydzajslh: I already sent email to the group and updated wiki + informed everyone on Skype that meeting is postponed15:28
jamtodayajaksu: You have a user object, and a program object. The goal is to retrieve all projects linking the user to the program15:28
lhsolydzajs: thanks15:28
ajaksusolydzajs: sorry, missed your testing guidelines msg, I'll post them later tonight15:28
Meriosolydzajs rulez :P15:29
solydzajsajaksu: thanks15:29
lhin that case i am going to go get some lunch.15:29
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lhajaksu jamtoday: expect feedback on wednesday if not before15:29
solydzajslh: bon apetit ;-)15:29
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lhsolydzajs: gracias.15:29
ajaksulh: great, thanks! :)15:29
jamtodaylh: great. looking forward to it15:29
lhLennie|Andy: will send you email15:29
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Lennie|Andymail?15:30
solydzajsLennie|Andy: will talk to you after conference call tomorrow as we scheduled15:30
Lennie|Andyyes sure15:30
Lennie|Andysorry guys15:30
solydzajsI will get some sleep now cause I'm kind of jetlagged ;-)15:30
Lennie|Andydont forget your weekly updates15:30
solydzajstechnology sucks no worries ;-)15:30
solydzajsshit happens ;-)15:30
ajaksujamtoday: ok, that bit seems easy... once we have all programs that link the user to the survey's program, what do we do with that information? fetch mentors for those projects? record them?15:30
* Merio done in the blog15:30
* solydzajs is gone.15:31
MerioLennie|Andy: ^^15:31
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Lennie|Andyokay i missed the proposed solution15:32
Meriodhans: may we can get in sync in the meantime?15:33
* ajaksu will borrow a laptop to avoid having to choose one of unintelligibly noisy audio or screaming like a madman so people could hear him15:34
jamtodayajaksu: all projects you mean? :) The project should be included in the SurveyRecord entity15:35
ajaksujamtoday: yes, all projects :D15:35
Meriodhans: ping!15:35
Lennie|Andybuy a proper headset :P15:35
jamtodayajaksu: The project should be included for students, but it's essential for mentors.15:35
ajaksujamtoday: so we offer a drop-down with all the projects and the user picks one?15:35
Lennie|Andyesential for both15:35
dhansMerio: you mean now? Because I have to leave in like ten minutes and can be back in about 40 minutes, but I was thinking about having a meeting tomorrow. is it good for you?15:36
jamtodayajaksu: So when I'm a mentor who grades a project, then it will be explicitly referenced which project I'm passing15:36
Meriodhans: yep, for me it's ok tomorrow. When will you be available?15:36
Lennie|Andy(if there is only one you can auto-redirect to that one)15:36
jamtodayLennie: Yes, essential for both. But extra-essential for mentors :)15:36
ajaksujamtoday: we could let the mentor set the student project if the student has more than one, as he already sets a grade in the records, and link the single project in the more commom case?15:37
dhansMerio: all day15:37
Lennie|Andyas long as the survey shows which one15:37
Meriodhans: same for me, as always I'll be here all day, all the time15:37
jamtodayajaksu: I'm thinking that....we might as well show everyone what project is associated with that survey, and if only one project is shown they can't change it15:38
dhansMerio: me as well, unless I forget to log in :-P15:38
dhansMerio: so, I'll try to ping you at about 11 (so it's probably 10 in the uk)15:38
Meriodhans: please not do :) Is very important that this period we're in a very very close sync, otherwise we'll come with a mess15:39
Meriodhans: I'll be here as soon as I'll wake up, so np :)15:39
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dhansMerio: ok, so see you15:40
Meriodhans: see you tomorrow :)15:41
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* Merio washing dishes15:41
Lenniewow15:41
Lennieinterenetz!15:41
Lenniefinally I can type faster :P15:41
Lennieso15:41
Lennieajaksu, jamtoday what did I miss about the permission/selction talk?15:41
ajaksuLennie: on my side, you missed the penny stating to drop as I now see what and why we want about that :)15:42
Lenniek15:43
Lennieso yes most importantly multiple choice, open text questions15:43
Lennieyes/no answer15:43
Lennieand permissions :)15:43
ajaksujamtoday: where does CHOOSE_A_GRADE_FIELD fit in that? is it something to be shown per record or about the whole survey? Or is it a field for mentors to talk about student projects?15:43
Lennie^^15:43
ajaksuyes/no answer we don't have but I think we should, it's an important special case of pick_one :)15:44
LennieOh I meant fail or no fail :P15:45
Lenniemy mistake15:45
Lenniethe CHOOSE_A_GRADE_FIELD one :)15:45
Lenniesolydzajs, you gone yet?15:45
Lenniego away!15:45
Lenniesleep15:45
Lennieit's about normal sleep time in Poland15:45
Lennieso it will help if you go now :)15:45
ajaksuLennie: ok, but we have a pass/fail field per record once grades are enabled, the CHOOSE_A_GRADE_FIELD seems to be something per-survey? jamtoday?15:46
Lenniehmm?15:46
Lennieas long as the only one passing or failing a student is the mentor I'm happy :)15:46
ajaksuOK :)15:48
Lennieor higher for that matter :p15:48
LennieProgram admin and higher that is15:49
Lenniejust in case crazyness occurs :D15:49
ajaksuLennie: hmm, should I remove the bribe-a-coder backdoors then? :)15:50
Lenniehehe15:51
ajaksujamtoday1: I still need hints about your design for the choose a grade field, and I want to know whether I can go for the permissions code or should focus on other areas :)15:51
LennieI just filled in the surveys on melange-ajaksu15:51
Lennielooks cool, somethings are out of whack on IE7 though15:52
Lennieatleast15:52
Lenniethe bullet lists are15:52
Lennieso the multiple choice questions15:52
Lennieajaksu, is there any question where I'm forced to submit an answer?15:52
ajaksuLennie: cool! ah, it looks very bad in opera too, I have to spend some time on CSS tunning15:53
ajaksuLennie: not yet, but I'm actually passing 'required=False' to fields, so it could be a per-question setting whether it's required or not15:53
Lennieif possible it should be selectable by the user15:54
Lennieotherwise it needs to be forced ^^15:54
ajaksuand I have the tooltips hardcoded, I think they'd be more valuable if the survey creator could set help_text per question, with a default of instructions about the question type... but it might be overengineering a bit :)15:55
Lenniehehe15:55
Lenniedefineatly a nice to have15:55
Lenniebut I'm looking at it from a functional point of view15:55
Lennieas in something we need to have soon :D15:55
Lenniebut working tooltips looks nice15:55
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Lennieajaksu16:01
Lenniejamtoday16:01
Lenniecan we change the deadline to a start and end?16:01
ajaksusure, I can do it quickly if jamtoday agrees :)16:01
Lenniefeels better16:02
Lennieso that LH can prepare the survey before people can see it16:02
ajaksuI was thinking that we should also use the timeuntil format for the survey-taking view: 'you have 2 days left for taking this survey'16:02
Lenniewould indeed be cool :D16:03
Lenniebut from an admin point of view, you want to have it in place before it starts16:03
Lenniejamtoday, ping pong :D?16:03
ajaksuLennie: it's already possible by having read access set to e.g. admin then lowering to the desirable level, but having an interval actually records when it was made available, so it's better way IMO :)16:04
Lennieyes16:05
Lenniebut16:05
Lenniethe access level way requires manually change at time of "opening"16:05
Lennieinterval is automatic :D16:05
ajaksubtw, one's survey answers are still viewable after the deadline, but read-only... and always viewable in the results table in a read-only taking UI16:06
Lennieok16:08
Lennieis there a general place where they can find their surveys?16:08
ajaksuLennie: nope, let me check but I'm almost sure :)16:10
Lennieok16:10
Lenniethey need atleast a link to their grading surveys16:11
ajaksuIf I'm correct, I think the separated results page James suggested could be really handy, so we can filter records per project or per mentor... and students could see all their answers to different surveys in a single page16:11
Lenniek16:11
Lenniesounds right16:12
Lennieso there are two things bothering me16:12
Lenniefirst of them was the deadline thing :)16:12
ajaksuwait, does 'they' refer to students or mentors? because the surveys listing kinda works for mentors, as it links to the edit pages :)16:12
Lennieboth of them would be nice16:12
Lenniesecondly16:13
Lenniehmm16:13
Lennieit looks like surveys and grading surveys are connected a lot16:14
ajaksuok, I'll claim the deadline fix on W.O.16:14
Lenniesince I need to hit add grades on an existing survey to make it have grades16:14
Lennieis there a way to seperate the two?16:14
ajaksuLennie: or tick the 'gradable' checkbox on creation... but yes, we could have 'create a gradable survey' and make 'create a survey' locked for non-gradable ones, maybe add some checks to lock adding grades so only admins can do that?16:16
Lenniehmm16:17
ajaksuthe flexibility we offer might be a hindrance16:17
LennieI'm pondering if the grading survey should have preset access check16:17
Lennieso16:18
Lenniehmm16:18
ajaksuyes? yes? :)16:18
Lennieit should be possible to link a student project grading survey (the one only filled in by mentors)16:19
Lennieto be linked to16:19
Lenniethe one to be filled in by students16:19
Lenniesince afaik in GSoC's case16:19
Lennieboth need to be filled in to pass16:19
LennieI'll double check that now :)16:19
ajaksuLennie: I think that might be the goal of the CHOOSE_A_GRADE_FIELD, but I'm only guessing16:20
Lennieyeah might be the reason16:20
Lenniebut it isn't really choosing anymore right?16:20
Lenniesince it comes automatically16:20
Lennieif the program admin does not overwrite it16:20
Lenniepseudocode woot:16:21
Lenniestudent_passed = mentor_survey.has_passed; if survey hasStudentSurvey and Student has not completed Survey: student_passed = False16:22
Lenniemakes sense :):16:22
Lennie*?16:23
ajaksusure, makes a lot of sense and could be made flexible to allow linking arbitrary surveys16:23
Lenniehmm16:24
Lennietrue16:24
Lennie<- thinking from what we need Point of View :)16:24
ajaksuwe should implement it for mentor->student now16:24
Lennieso16:24
LennieI double checked16:24
ajaksuyes, agreed :)16:24
Lenniewe will not fail them16:24
Lenniehowever16:24
Lenniethere needs to be a way to tell that they have not filled it in16:24
Lenniesince Google does not want to pay them16:25
ajaksua report? we'd need something like that for notifications too ("Hi Student, You only have one day left for taking survey X and won't see the monies if you don't, Cheers")16:27
Lennieno16:28
Lenniehmm16:28
LennieI wasn't specific :D16:28
Lenniemore like "This student has not filled it in"16:28
Lenniefor the Program Admin aka LH16:28
ajaksuSo we should hook it to the student model? I was thinking about listing the students that haven't answered per-survey, but we could add a logic check like 'hasStudentTakenSurvey' instead of changing the student model... wait, let me think :)16:32
Lenniehmm16:32
Lennieit shouldn't be per student16:32
Lenniebut per project16:32
Lennieyou could generate the list though16:32
Lennieby doing some sort of job16:32
Lenniethat checks for all project16:32
Lennies16:32
Lenniebut I thought jamtoday had a good idea about this16:33
ajaksuwhoa, per project? I was thinking a project was something a student owned/was responsible for...16:33
* ajaksu goes back to the wiki16:33
Lennietrue16:34
Lenniebut there is a survey for each project16:34
Lennie(I might be using confusing terminology here since I haven't dug through your code)16:35
Lenniebut I meant a set of Answers to a survey for each project16:36
ajaksuI'm a bit lost here too, I think a survey *result* should have a project (and be linked to a student), while a survey only knows about the program, *however*, I think jamtoday sees this differently and his design could be in line with the way you see it :)16:37
Lenniehmm16:38
ajaksuaha, ok, a set of answers per project, agreed and understood :)16:38
Lenniesurvey needs to know if the student answered or the mentor then16:38
ajaksuright now I have this POC query:16:38
ajaksuhttp://paste.pocoo.org/show/123363/16:39
tpbTitle: Paste #123363 | LodgeIt! (at paste.pocoo.org)16:39
ajaksugiving a per-survey set of users that don't have a survey_record (answers to a given survey)16:40
Lennie`hmm16:42
Lenniewill not work16:43
ajaksu(of course, the gql + set sucks and is prone to hitting the entity limit)16:43
Lenniesince we have registered students without a project16:43
ajaksuanother penny drops! we could filter by 'has_project', but linking 'has_taken_survey' to the project makes more sense indeed :)16:44
Lenniehmm16:47
Lenniesounds good16:47
Lennieyou could put this in a job16:48
Lennieand use key as iterator16:48
Lennie*iterate over key16:48
Lenniesince you won't need an index then16:48
Lennieanyhow16:48
LennieI have to change one of my statements :D16:48
LennieWe will want to fail projects for which the survey is not filled in16:48
Lenniebut16:49
Lenniea program admin shoud be able to revert it16:49
Lennie(afaik, James discussed this with us a few weeks ago)16:49
LennieLH is okay with failing students who don't fill in their survey as long as she can revert it16:49
ajaksuOK, but is our (as in surveys-team) job to make the failing happen or just offer the tools for checking whether a survey is taken, so the project-side code (which we might write ourselves :)) can act on the results of those checks? :)16:50
Lenniehmm16:51
Lennieit's something we need to work together on16:51
Lenniebasically it will be some kind of process results button16:51
Lenniebut16:52
Lenniethat's something that can happen in the weeks during the survey process16:52
Lenniemost important is that the query to do something like that is easy16:52
Lenniesomehow you want to have an easy query for all SurveyResult for one survey16:53
Lenniehmm16:53
Lenniesomehow you want to have an easy query for all SurveyResult for one survey, is a lie :)16:53
Lennieyou want to query for project and result16:53
Lenniesince not every project might have a result16:53
Lenniesorry for being so unclear, I'm thinking and typing :D16:54
Lennieonly had 5 hours of sleep :D16:54
Lenniewhich is more then Pawel :P16:54
ajaksusorry, went away and I'm back...16:58
Lenniecool16:59
Lennielet's recap a bit16:59
Lenniesince I'm getting sleepy16:59
Lennieso16:59
Lennieyou are changing the deadline to be a start/end date combination16:59
LennieThe permission discussion/implementatoin will continue between you and jamtoday16:59
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LennieThe set of answers to a survey need to be coupled to atleast a project17:00
ajaksuok, so we could have a 'tally results' button that incrementally marks projects as in the clear as far as that survey goes17:00
Lenniesomething like that yes17:00
LennieI think jamtoday knows more about it17:01
LennieThe create survey/create grading survey need to be more seperated17:01
Lenniethe grading survey needs the ability to be linked to another survey that students can fill in17:01
Lennieif a student/mentor didn't fill in the survey for a project the project should be failed, there should be an interface for LH to undo this17:02
Lenniethe latter one can be done after the surveys launch17:03
Lenniebut the others seem to be a must17:03
ajaksuOK, I'll mae this a high priority issue17:03
Lenniefeels necessary for survey basics17:03
Lennieatleast grading survey basics17:04
ajaksuI've filled an issue for the deadline (and one for awful CSS, one for the results page), jamtoday just filled one because I've broken his "don't lose everything on failed POST" code, we'll discuss and work on the project-results link, and there's the mentor-grading-survey->student-survey link as a high priority goal17:04
Lenniecool17:04
ajaksuso far, I was thinking of grading as "do these answers award a 'pass' grade?", but now I see the place of the project grading survey in the GSoC workflow, thank your *very* much for helping me understand this :)17:06
Lenniecan you give me the link to your patch queue?17:06
Lenniehehe17:06
Lennieyou are having the same enlightment as James had when he met us17:06
Lennieso to be clear17:06
LennieStudent + Mentor both need to fill in a survey17:06
Lenniethis should be one set of surveys17:06
Lennieonly the Mentor can give a grade about the project17:06
Lenniebased on that we either pass or fail the project that is linked to the answers of the Student+Mentor17:07
Lennieso17:07
Lenniebasically17:07
LennieJames midterm review is coming up17:07
Lennieand Sverre being his mentor can either fail him D17:07
Lennieor have him pass17:07
Lenniewhich in GSoC case means that he gets more money :P17:08
* ajaksu marks the bribe-the-coder spot on the map17:08
Lennie:D17:08
ajaksumy... patch queue? as in 'not-my-bitbucket-nor-github-repo but the proposed patches for merging'?17:09
Lenniesomething like that17:09
LennieYou said that issues are being filled17:09
Lenniejust wondering where17:09
Lennie(I haven't been on top of the surveys Sverre has been :D)17:10
Lennieso I'm out of the loop here17:10
ajaksuah, James's issue tracker on github: http://github.com/jamslevy/Melange/issues#sort=updated (where you can also find our code linked, but it'll need massaging before we can ask for a merge)17:11
tpb<http://ln-s.net/3KK1> (at github.com)17:11
Lennieok thanks17:13
LennieI'm off for today17:14
Lenniethanks for all your work ajaksu17:14
Lenniekeep it up17:15
ajaksugood night, Lennie, and thank you for your help :)17:15
Lennienp17:15
Lennieif you have any questions just poke me17:15
Lennieor poke the list17:15
Lenniethe sooner the better17:15
ajaksuOK, I should go write mails now :)17:15
ajaksusee ya17:16
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ajaksujamtoday: ping-at-ya :)17:19
jamtoday1ajaksu: pingback17:49
ajaksujamtoday: I've had a major upgrade to my understanding of the project grading use case, thanks to Lennie, do you have time to discuss some details about it now? Also, do you plan to work on this or can I start it as soon as I unbreak the failed POST  protection? :)17:53
jamtoday1I'll do it17:54
jamtoday1For the longest time I wasn't using the GAE admin features17:54
jamtoday1and being able to see the datastore is helpful :)17:55
jamtoday1I'll know in a few minutes if I can crack it17:55
ajaksuok, then I'll work on the deadline-as-interval and other open issues after I unbreak failed POSTs and mail some notes to the list :)17:57
jamtoday1ajaksu: I'm using a debug method to make the current user a mentor or student as necessary to test18:25
jamtoday1probably don't want this feature pushed to production though18:25
jamtoday1just our private staging servers18:26
ajaksujamtoday: that is great, one of the mails I have to write would be about getting other melange developers to play different roles, doing it in a testing environment first/instead sounds like a huge iimprovement to me18:28
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jamtoday1ajaksu: There's certainly a need for more automation with students, mentors, and student projects19:10
jamtoday1Especially because of the complexities due to the program_owner/program/org schema19:11
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