Tuesday, 2009-03-03

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tlarsen|afkdurin42: Still around?00:09
tlarsen|afktansell: We actually just need an actual "build" step.00:09
tlarsen|afktansell: We already have pylint and broken import detection.  It is just that no one runs it.00:10
tanselltlarsen|afk, oh? I thought that was part of the release process?00:10
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tlarsentansell: I don't know if Pawel is running the pylint stuff when he cuts a Melange release or not.00:11
tlarsentansell: Pawel is actually the person who got the pylint stuff working.00:11
tansellwe did have some tests in the distance past00:11
tansellI love tests when someone else creates them ;)00:14
tlarsentansell: buildbot is here, but there is no "build" step:  http://google1.osuosl.org:8012/waterfall00:16
tpbTitle: BuildBot: Melange (at google1.osuosl.org:8012)00:16
tansellI don't really know what you mean by "build" step00:17
tlarsentansell: Also, I don't know if Augie has it triggering on the http://code.google.com/p/support/wiki/PostCommitWebHooks yet.  I think he still has it periodically probing.00:18
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2x04> (at code.google.com)00:18
tansellhrm, pushing the new instance seems to have wiped the old load data00:30
tlarsentansell: Not usually.00:30
tlarsentansell: Sverre was going to do it, though.00:30
tlarsentansell: It wasn't wiped when I checked right after the push.00:30
tlarsentansell: Pawel and Sverre mentioned some schema incompatibilities that were going to require them to wipe most of it, though.00:31
tanselltlarsen, I mean the Request/Second graph00:31
tlarsenAh, the stats.00:31
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tanselltlarsen, can you push a new version with the fix durin42 pushed?00:34
tlarsenNope.00:36
tlarsenI am about to go to bed, and I can't spend any more time on Melange this week.00:36
tlarsen(it is a 20% project, and I spent 4 days on it last week :(00:36
tlarsenI can add you to /p/soc-google/ and you can give it a try, if you like.00:37
tlarsentansell: [email protected] right?00:37
tlarsentansell: Anyway, you've been added as a Project Owner here: http://code.google.com/p/soc-google/00:38
tpbTitle: soc-google - Google Code (at code.google.com)00:38
tansellokay00:39
tlarsentansell: And you are already a Developer here:  http://appengine.google.com/permissions?&app_id=socghop00:39
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2x09> (at appengine.google.com)00:39
tlarsenThe steps are here:00:39
tlarsenhttp://code.google.com/p/soc-google/wiki/ImportingMelangeRelease00:39
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2ne5> (at code.google.com)00:39
tlarsenYou would only need to do a patch release, cherry-picking a patch, revving the patch version in app.yaml from g2 to g3, then doing the tagging and archiving, etc.00:40
tlarsenNo need to do the vendor branch import, which is the longest step (sometimes the commit takes over an hour to complete).00:40
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SRabbelier|Andytansell: how is the load testing going?02:23
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tansell-laptopSRabbelier|Andy, I did the 5QPS earlier02:33
tansell-laptopsee the email02:33
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tansell-laptop<tansell-laptop> SRabbelier|Andy, I did the 5QPS earlier02:43
tansell-laptop<tansell-laptop> see the email02:43
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SRabbeliertansell-laptop: ah, yup; the results should still be available when02:59
tansell-laptop?02:59
SRabbeliers/when//02:59
SRabbeliertansell-laptop: you tested on socghop, right?03:00
tansell-laptopyes03:00
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lhSRabbelier: ping10:48
SRabbelierlh: pong10:48
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SRabbelierlh: what's up?10:49
* SRabbelier goes back to coding10:54
SRabbelierlh: ping again if you're back10:54
lhSRabbelier: can you give developer privledges to lh on socghop.appspot.com please?10:54
SRabbelierlh: sure10:54
lhthanks10:55
* lh heads to get ready for the day, then will work on more testing10:55
SRabbelierlh: db-wise dev privilidges10:55
SRabbelierlh: or gae-wise?10:55
lhSRabbelier: i am honestly not sure what the difference is. can you explain?10:55
SRabbelierlh: with GAE-wise I mean adding you to the Dev console for appspot.com, which means you can go to appspot.com and look at the logs etc.10:56
SRabbelierlh: with Melange-wise (that's perhaps a better term)  I mean so that Melange considers you a dev (you can delete users, etc), but appspot.com doesn't care10:56
lhSRabbelier: i don't need logs access. db-wise will be fine.10:57
lhsrabbelier: i don't need logs access, so melange-wise (db-wise) is fine10:57
lhhrm. xchat aqua is being unkind to me today10:57
* SRabbelier comforts lh10:57
SRabbelierlh: will do10:57
lhSRabbelier: thank you sir. :)10:57
* lh goes off for a bit10:58
SRabbelierlh: [email protected] I assume?10:58
lh[email protected]10:58
lhplease10:58
lhthanks10:58
SRabbelierlh: will do10:59
lhSRabbelier: thanks again10:59
SRabbelierlh: no worries :)10:59
* SRabbelier is seriously considering falling back to the Django GAE ships with11:03
SRabbelierzipimporting Django just takes too effin' long11:03
SRabbelierto those interested: I got a mail from my recruiter saying "Good news!  Your first round of interviews went well and we will be proceeding to the next stage in the process."11:42
lhSRabbelier: congratulations my friend. that's the last step. things are lookin' good! :)12:13
SRabbelierlh: woooh :D12:14
* SRabbelier dances12:14
lhin fact, that last call is usally with the person who would be your host (manager while you are interning)12:14
SRabbelierlh: yeah, I'm hoping to ping spearce soon12:15
lhSRabbelier: cool.12:15
* SRabbelier nods12:17
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lhall hail Lennie12:18
Lennieello servants ^_^?12:18
Lenniewassup lh?12:18
Lennienot much :P?12:35
* MatthewWilkes hails Lennie12:38
MatthewWilkes(Don't let it go to your head! ;)12:38
Lenniehehe12:38
LennieSir Matthew, you may rise12:38
lhLennie: true. working on faqs with anchored links for socghop.appspot.com12:38
lhlol12:38
Lennieok12:39
Lennieis it working for you?12:39
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penyaskitoSRabbelier, sorry for the OT: What's a precog? :-P13:17
SRabbelierpenyaskito: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precog13:31
tpbTitle: Precognition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at en.wikipedia.org)13:31
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penyaskitoSRabbelier, thanks... I went to GTranslate and WordReference, didn't thought about WP.... /slap me13:35
SRabbelierhehe, understandable13:36
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N4L|Lenniemovie references ftw13:58
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SRabbelierLennie: hehe, you got the reference :D13:58
SRabbelierawesome13:58
Lennie^_^13:58
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SRabbelierLennie: bug fixed14:12
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LennieSRabbelier: sweet, docu bug?15:23
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Lennie|Gone<- doing the dishes :p15:24
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James--CrookLennie: http://socghop.appspot.com/org/list_public/google/gsoc2009 is a server 500.  What's the story there?  It wasn't a server 500 in the previous incarnation.15:54
Lenniegood question15:57
* Lennie points at SRabbelier for forgetting to add an empty dictionary15:59
SRabbelier:(16:00
SRabbelierLennie: what'd I do?16:00
tlarsenJames--Crook: Known bug.  See comments here:16:00
tlarsenhttp://code.google.com/p/soc/source/detail?r=216016:00
tlarsenhttp://code.google.com/p/soc/source/detail?r=223516:00
tlarsenhttp://code.google.com/p/soc/issues/detail?id=29016:00
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2xC2> (at code.google.com)16:00
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2xC3> (at code.google.com)16:00
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2xC4> (at code.google.com)16:00
James--CrookThnx todd.16:00
Lennieno tlarsen16:00
Lenniethat's not the bug16:01
James--CrookAlso at http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/user/jamescrook/userfaq16:01
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2wMo> (at socghop.appspot.com)16:01
tlarsenLennie: Well, that is the one tansell was finding last night.16:01
Lennietlarsen: it's not the one occurring right now16:01
tlarsenLennie: There is another?16:01
Lennieyes16:01
Lennieread the logs :)16:01
James--CrookWhich logs lennie?16:02
Lennieappengine ones16:02
James--CrookHo ho.  I can't do that :-)16:02
James--CrookAnyways, can't do much testing at the moment it seems as it's less functional for me than it was before the update (other than getting the extra field for application template)16:03
tlarsenJames--Crook: Well, I'm not doing another push to socghop.appspot.com, since I am trying to get someone else to have experience doing it (tansell).16:04
tlarsenmelange-demo.appspot.com is supposed to stay the release that is on socghop.appspot.com, but the Melange one instead of the /p/soc-google/ one.16:04
LennieI fixed the bugs in r224216:05
tlarsenPerhaps someone can cherry-pick the fixes into the Melange release branch, tag another release, and push it up to melange-demo?16:05
tlarsenmelange-dev.appspot.com is available for committers to push whatever revision they want, not necessarily a release.16:06
James--CrookAnd presumably it's easier to push to, less red tape?16:06
LennieJames--Crook16:06
tlarsenCutting a new tag from an already-released /p/soc/ branch is pretty quick.16:06
Lenniewhat's the other bug you are having?16:06
James--CrookJust a server 500 on a different page.  Means I can't check the changes to hyperlinks in docs.  It's a docs page.  I thought I might merge some changes in whilst I was at it too.16:07
Lennieyour user doc right?16:08
James--CrookList of orgs prevents me checking whether I really deleted Alpha Test org, which was my intention, though it has now gone from my sidebar.16:08
James--CrookYep, at http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/user/jamescrook/userfaq16:08
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2wMo> (at socghop.appspot.com)16:08
James--Crook..About to try creating a new doc, see if that works...16:10
Lennietry again James--Crook16:10
James--CrookWorks now.  What did you do??16:10
Lennieyou created a new user account16:11
Lennieso your documents couldn't be resolved16:11
James--CrookAhh... and you got rid of the new one (Sverre half got rid of it)16:11
Lennieno16:11
SRabbelierLennie: yes16:12
LennieI changed the documents to point to the new one I guess16:12
James--Crookchuckles.  confused.16:12
James--Crook(me confused that is)16:12
SRabbelierLennie: that does work :)16:12
Lenniedont worry James--Crook, GSoC will start with a clean datastore anyway :)16:12
Lenniesomeone should cherry pick r2242 ^^16:12
James--CrookWhilst you're both here, how easy is it to remove the rogue drupal org?16:12
Lenniefor us it's easy :p16:13
James--CrookI can't do anything with it as I am not an admin anymore.16:13
Lenniewant to become an admin for it?16:13
James--CrookAh, then I need to change the wording on the bug report.16:13
Lennieit's not super easy for us :D16:13
James--CrookNo, don't want to become an admin on socghop, too dangerous, and also may hide some testing issues.16:13
James--CrookOK, well, Lennie, if you look in your sidebar you should see that Scalp Hunters have been a very naughty org.16:14
James--CrookThey changed their name after sign up, and they have featured ads in the sidebar.16:14
James--CrookI think they and the rogue drupal should be evicted.  Do you agree :-)16:14
Lennieyeah :P16:15
Lennieonly 80% genuine spam16:15
Lennie:(16:15
James--CrookAlso Test Test is admin less.  I want to clean up before we have students applying.16:15
James--Crook(Ok so that is a little way away yet)16:15
Lenniethere is no group managment interface yet16:16
James--CrookAnother thing - I have sent out quite a few invites for mentors, but no one has answered these.16:16
Lenniebut we can set it's status to inactive if they are really bad :P16:16
Lennieyou want to cancel those?16:16
James--CrookSo would one of you be a mentor on Audacity Extra, I'll send an invite.16:16
Lenniek16:16
James--CrookYes cancel those one.  Bad boys.16:16
LennieI like being admin for the naughty spam gruop :)16:17
Lennieyou should be able to cancel it if you list your requests and invites16:17
James--CrookOk, then if you want to keep it for a bit to test admin that is fine too, but I might tone down their act a little16:17
James--CrookUm, I don't think I can cancel the rogue drupa116:18
James--Crook"There is no application that would allow you to visit this page."16:19
James--CrookSame for Test Test and Alpha Test.16:19
James--Crook...inviting you to AudacityExtra now...16:19
Lennieshould you be able to visit those?16:20
Lennietest test is completed16:21
tlarsenJames--Crook: What is the link_id for Scalp Hunters?16:21
Lennieyee mentor invite :p16:21
James--Crookhttp://socghop.appspot.com/org/show/google/gsoc2009/scalap16:23
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2xCT> (at socghop.appspot.com)16:23
James--Crookthey went in as some supercompiler project :-)16:23
tlarsenThat brings up a good question, how does one see an Org's featured docs?16:24
James--CrookI've raised a bug on that.16:24
SRabbeliertlarsen: I think there's no way to16:24
tlarsenShouldn't we have some per-Org sidebar that only displays when you are viewing that Org's public page?16:24
tlarsen(I wouldn't want to see them all, all the time.)16:24
SRabbeliertlarsen: we have one16:24
SRabbeliertlarsen: proper sidebar that is16:24
James--CrookThere will be a link on the org info page to the home page,16:24
James--Crookand admins add a list there.16:24
James--CrookHeck, I'd better share my 'faqs doc with yoyu todd.  The issues which aren't going to be resolved need to end up in documentation, so I'm keeping notes.16:26
tlarsenJames--Crook: Are these issues in the issue tracker as well?16:26
tlarsenJames--Crook: I was just thinking that, if I am viewing http://socghop.appspot.com/org/show/google/gsoc2009/scalap, I ought to be seeing what the Org set as a Home page, instead of the info page.16:27
tlarsen(the info page is still useful, though)16:27
tlarsenWhen I am viewing that per-Org home page, they ought to get a Scalp Hunters sidebar menu that has:16:27
tlarsen* their Featured Documents16:27
tlarsen* their "Show Organization" info page16:28
James--CrookSure, that would be nice.16:28
tlarsen* maybe other stuff, such as a link to a list of members or admins.16:28
tlarsenI could open these as Type-Feature issues, I suppose.16:28
James--Crookhttp://docs.google.com/Doc?id=df5k4pfh_6fwgrtqdn&hl=en16:28
tpb<http://ln-s.net/2xCa> (at docs.google.com)16:28
James--CrookLennie, you're now listed as a mentor in AudacityExtra.  Thanks.16:30
Lennie^^16:30
Lennieyee16:30
James--CrookAnother thing I'm wondering about...16:31
James--Crookwith all mail now coming from [email protected], it's not obvious who to contact if you get a mentor invite and want to discuss it.  There  might be two admins.16:32
James--CrookIs there an easy way for someone who receives an invite to work out who to reply to?16:33
LennieFrom: James Crook16:33
LennieTo: Lennie16:33
Lenniethat's what it says16:33
Lenniethe notification system will one day be changed into a message system :p16:34
Lenniebut you can atleast find out what the public name is of the person who invited you16:34
James--CrookOh, OK.  That's cool then.  User can then look up the org and see the contact details.16:34
Lennieyes16:34
Lenniethey'll just have to for this year :D16:34
James--Crook(and if they're not smart enough to do that they shouldn't be a mentor)16:35
Lennie:)16:35
James--CrookOK.  I think that's me done for now.16:35
LennieJames--Crook16:57
Lenniewanna help :p16:57
Lenniecome up with description for numbers [-4,4] :D16:57
Lennieas in the score you assign a student application :P16:58
tlarsenLennie: -4 Wow. This. Sucks.16:59
tlarsen:)16:59
Lenniek16:59
Lenniefine by me :P16:59
tlarsenLennie: 4 Made. Of. Awesome.16:59
tlarsen:)16:59
Lenniethere in :D16:59
Lennietheir16:59
Lenniehmm16:59
Lenniethey are16:59
tlarsenLennie: They're ?17:00
Lenniehurray anglais17:00
Lennieyes tlarsen17:00
tlarsen:)17:00
tlarsenLennie: Your English is far better than my Dutch.17:00
Lennieit has to be :D17:00
Lenniejust temporary17:01
Lennie(-4,'-4: Wow. This. Sucks.'),17:01
Lennie(-3,'-3: Needs a lot of work'),17:01
Lennie(-2,'-2: This is bad'),17:01
Lennie(-1,'-1: I dont like this'),17:01
Lennie(0,'0: No score'),17:01
Lennie(1,'1: Might have potential'),17:01
Lennie(2,'2: Good'),17:01
Lennie(3,'3: Almost there'),17:01
Lennie(4,'4: Made. Of. Awesome.')]17:01
Lennie^_^17:01
SRabbelierLennie: lol17:01
LennieSverre Robber-ier :-/17:06
Lennielol :P17:06
Lenniewho's impersonating sverre ^_^?17:06
James--CrookWasn't me honest.17:06
Lennie:D17:06
Lennienah17:06
SRabbelier:(17:06
Lenniemister good org :P17:06
durin42I like 4.17:06
James--CrookThat's not me either.  Look at the sidebar.17:06
Lennie:)17:06
James--CrookI don't see  any real danger with this.17:07
James--CrookIt's convoluted and at the very worst someone tricks a genuine person into being a mentor in their group, giving them legitimacy.17:07
James--CrookBut very soon found out.17:08
James--CrookAnd I don't see anyone being able to make money out of it, so the motivation is very small.17:08
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tlarsenJames--Crook: Yes, but Google will be vetting the Org apps.17:10
James--Crooktlarsen: True, but it is possible to impersonate a legitimate org.  That is how scalp hunters got through.17:12
tlarsenJames--Crook: Ummm, this is during the testing period.  The real Org apps will be examined with much more rigor.17:18
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James--Crooktlarsen: I realise that.  Impersonating an org that is actually applying (and has an ideas list) is the only way it could really work, I think - and it would be found out in no time.  I am just concerned about the mutability of org name and user name, which is a new feature with Melange, and exploring if it can do harm.  (conclusion so far is no real harm, it will be found out fast).  Pm if you want to talk about security in more detail.17:27
tlarsenJames--Crook: Well, for the per-Program Orgs (unlike Clubs, that are site-wide--and implemented but currently disabled), we could always freeze certain Org attributes at a certain date, say the "org acceptance" date.17:33
tlarsenBut, to correct mistakes, Orgs should at least be able to change the Org name during the application phase.17:33
James--CrookYes, agree, on balance it is a good feature, and will solve a number of problems.  (We just perhaps need to be careful that the LinkID shows on cases where an identity is important).17:36
James--CrookSo far none of the messages are important enough that a LinkID has to be shown.17:36
James--CrookI guess my concern is more with students...  Pm if you want to discuss.17:38
MatthewWilkesJames--Crook: This discussion is on topic, as long as it's not confidential it'd be nice to keep it in here17:49
MatthewWilkesPeople like me do like to lurk and keep aware of these things :)17:49
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Lenniejee18:18
Lenniebasic student proposal scoring :p18:18
MatthewWilkesLennie: ?18:18
Lenniethat it has been committed :P18:18
Lennienow I'm off to bed18:18
Lennienn :)18:18
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James--CrookHigh guys, just a concern that Melange is going to be launched live before features that are needed for the full program are fully implemented.18:30
James--CrookThat means those features are not going to get tested, and particularly not security tested prior to the launch.18:31
James--CrookMy current concern is that there may be something related to the ability to impersonate another student that is a security weakness.  Any ideas how my concerns can be allayed?18:34
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tansellhey people18:57
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